WC Match 2016 - New York 10-30 November

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MartinCarpenter
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Re: WC Match 2016 - New York 10-30 November

Post by MartinCarpenter » Tue Nov 15, 2016 2:42 pm

There are still other ways to try and win, but it looks like Carlsen reckons he can beat Karjakin from these sorts of simple positions (with justification going by yesterday) and so he's little reason to try and do otherwise.

Karjakin won't need to implode to lose with white against Carlsen. Give him an equal but vaguely playable ending and Karjakin will be suffering all over again. Not quite sure what he'll try doing as white this time.

Matthew Turner
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Re: WC Match 2016 - New York 10-30 November

Post by Matthew Turner » Tue Nov 15, 2016 3:21 pm

Both games where Carlsen has been White have featured N against B. I wonder if Carlsen feels this is an area of weakness for Karjakin?
I felt Karjakin played one weak move yesterday namely Bg5. This is the first move that you look at, but you can quite easily see that it isn't that great. If you consider other alternatives then I think most of the time you'll happen on the far better Kg7. This seems a disappointing mistake to make the move after the time control. Karjakin will no doubt be relieved to survive this mishap, but perhaps a little apprehensive it might happen again.
In today's encounter, I don't really see Karjakin winning, in fact I think a Carlsen win is considerably more likely. However, a draw must surely be the overwhelming favourite.

Roger de Coverly
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Re: WC Match 2016 - New York 10-30 November

Post by Roger de Coverly » Tue Nov 15, 2016 7:17 pm

Matthew Turner wrote: In today's encounter, I don't really see Karjakin winning, in fact I think a Carlsen win is considerably more likely. However, a draw must surely be the overwhelming favourite.
It's the h3 anti-Marshall today, so no early simplification.

MartinCarpenter
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Re: WC Match 2016 - New York 10-30 November

Post by MartinCarpenter » Tue Nov 15, 2016 8:32 pm

Fight. Chess24's small online computer is saying 0.00 of course ;)

Richard Bates
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Re: WC Match 2016 - New York 10-30 November

Post by Richard Bates » Tue Nov 15, 2016 8:54 pm

MartinCarpenter wrote:Fight. Chess24's small online computer is saying 0.00 of course ;)
Strange decision by Karjakin to give up his light squared bishop. Must be seriously looking at a black win now.

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Carl Hibbard
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Re: WC Match 2016 - New York 10-30 November

Post by Carl Hibbard » Tue Nov 15, 2016 8:57 pm

Tired from yesterday but looks like self destruction here?
Cheers
Carl Hibbard

MartinCarpenter
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Re: WC Match 2016 - New York 10-30 November

Post by MartinCarpenter » Tue Nov 15, 2016 9:36 pm

There's definite signs of a deeply worrying appetite for suffering :) He could yet get away with this alive but.....

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Christopher Kreuzer
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Re: WC Match 2016 - New York 10-30 November

Post by Christopher Kreuzer » Tue Nov 15, 2016 9:59 pm

I must confess that some of the computer lines around moves 28 and 29 are a bit unfathomable... Not in the sense of tactics and fireworks, but more assessing which minor pieces are better. I suppose it is bread-and-butter stuff for GMs?

(Edit: 29.Rxd6 would have been fun.)

Roger de Coverly
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Re: WC Match 2016 - New York 10-30 November

Post by Roger de Coverly » Tue Nov 15, 2016 10:18 pm

Christopher Kreuzer wrote:Not in the sense of tactics and fireworks, but more assessing which minor pieces are better. I suppose it is bread-and-butter stuff for GMs?
You can usually talk of an advantage for the player with two Bishops against Bishop and Knight. If all else fails, there's the possibility of bailing out to the opposite Bishop ending.

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Christopher Kreuzer
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Re: WC Match 2016 - New York 10-30 November

Post by Christopher Kreuzer » Tue Nov 15, 2016 10:18 pm

This might be another draw. If White just sits there, Black may not be able to break through, even though he has by far the better position.

Roger de Coverly
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Re: WC Match 2016 - New York 10-30 November

Post by Roger de Coverly » Tue Nov 15, 2016 10:28 pm

Christopher Kreuzer wrote:If White just sits there, Black may not be able to break through, even though he has by far the better position.
An invasion by the Black King on the white squares might be the method. Presuming Carlsen has nothing better to do, he can play this for as long as he wants.

Chris Rice
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Re: WC Match 2016 - New York 10-30 November

Post by Chris Rice » Tue Nov 15, 2016 10:39 pm

Roger de Coverly wrote:
Christopher Kreuzer wrote:If White just sits there, Black may not be able to break through, even though he has by far the better position.
An invasion by the Black King on the white squares might be the method. Presuming Carlsen has nothing better to do, he can play this for as long as he wants.
Looks like we are in for another long night. I liked Svidler's comment: "no matter how much White improves his position he's never going to be equal"

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Christopher Kreuzer
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Re: WC Match 2016 - New York 10-30 November

Post by Christopher Kreuzer » Tue Nov 15, 2016 10:42 pm

Maybe not so long after 37.h4 as that is a definite blunder. Magnus really has to win now, after coming so close in the previous games. (Karjakin may have some fortresses in some lines.)

Chris Rice
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Re: WC Match 2016 - New York 10-30 November

Post by Chris Rice » Tue Nov 15, 2016 10:46 pm

Christopher Kreuzer wrote:Maybe not so long after 37.h4 as that is a definite blunder. Magnus really has to win now, after coming so close in the previous games.
If Black takes the h-pawn it releases the knight and that maybe worth a pawn. I was surprised he did it though but then he is 2772...

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Christopher Kreuzer
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Re: WC Match 2016 - New York 10-30 November

Post by Christopher Kreuzer » Tue Nov 15, 2016 10:51 pm

Some surprise that Carlsen didn't go for the lines where he was winning a clear pawn (on h4), but instead exchanged his d6 pawn for the h4 pawn. Still, White is still very limited in terms of how to get out of the bind, and will likely still lose.

(EDIT: Or maybe not. There are some drawing plans, and time enough for Karjakin to find them.)
Last edited by Christopher Kreuzer on Tue Nov 15, 2016 10:59 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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