Wijk aan Zee 2021

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John McKenna
Posts: 4450
Joined: Tue May 17, 2011 2:02 pm

Re: Wijk aan Zee 2021

Post by John McKenna » Thu Feb 04, 2021 11:07 am

"I think it's an inexact concept, as most things in language are."

That statement is quite an admission coming from one who tries to use questions like scalpels in order to dissect others' arguments.

It must also be said that when that approach fails to deliver the desired results our resident interlocator uses words as weapons.

And, if that approach fails he retreats into silence, which was probably his best policy in tbe first place.
To find a for(u)m that accommodates the mess, that is the task of the artist now. (Samuel Beckett)

Mick Norris
Posts: 8583
Joined: Tue Apr 17, 2007 10:12 am
Location: Bolton, Greater Manchester

Re: Wijk aan Zee 2021

Post by Mick Norris » Thu Feb 04, 2021 11:17 am

John McKenna wrote:
Thu Feb 04, 2021 10:32 am
I do not think the odds on an all-Dutch final at Wijk were as long as some think they were before the event.
Have you checked? The pre tournament favourite was Carlsen surely, as he is the best player

Caruana presumably second favourite

Giri up there too, with MVL

Van Foreest long odds I guess
Any postings on here represent my personal views and should not be taken as representative of the Manchester Chess Federation www.manchesterchess.co.uk

Matthew Turner
Posts: 3393
Joined: Fri May 16, 2008 11:54 am

Re: Wijk aan Zee 2021

Post by Matthew Turner » Thu Feb 04, 2021 11:22 am

Mick,
I think I heard in commentary that Van Foreest was 110-1 before the start, but personally I would have thought he should have been longer.

John McKenna
Posts: 4450
Joined: Tue May 17, 2011 2:02 pm

Re: Wijk aan Zee 2021

Post by John McKenna » Thu Feb 04, 2021 11:43 am

Not being a gambler I hardly ever check the odds.

In any sport the odds can be stacked in various ways.

My view of this tournament is that the individual games were competitive but the results were possibly biased by the circumstances that have existed since the previous edition.

Some of the factors that influenced the players during the tournament may have been subconcious and dictated by those circumstances I just mentioned.

Look at what happened to the now-long-suspended Candidates tournament if you want a reminder of what it is like to play chess while skating on thin ice.

Throw in playing excessively online and you are in an abnormal set of circumstances.
To find a for(u)m that accommodates the mess, that is the task of the artist now. (Samuel Beckett)

Mick Norris
Posts: 8583
Joined: Tue Apr 17, 2007 10:12 am
Location: Bolton, Greater Manchester

Re: Wijk aan Zee 2021

Post by Mick Norris » Thu Feb 04, 2021 12:08 pm

Matthew Turner wrote:
Thu Feb 04, 2021 11:22 am
Mick,
I think I heard in commentary that Van Foreest was 110-1 before the start, but personally I would have thought he should have been longer.
I think I read that he won roughly the same number of games as his 2 previous appearances, but the number of losses went from lots to a few to none

He may have adjusted to the top level and being Giri's second may have made him more solid

I will be really interested to see how he develops from here

The Dutch should be competitive in team events now too

As John says the current circumstances might be affecting results

Giri next OTB at the Candidates then Bucharest in June I think
Any postings on here represent my personal views and should not be taken as representative of the Manchester Chess Federation www.manchesterchess.co.uk

Paul Cooksey
Posts: 826
Joined: Fri Oct 21, 2016 4:15 pm

Re: Wijk aan Zee 2021

Post by Paul Cooksey » Thu Feb 04, 2021 12:47 pm

Matthew Turner wrote:
Thu Feb 04, 2021 11:22 am
I think I heard in commentary that Van Foreest was 110-1 before the start, but personally I would have thought he should have been longer.
I'm tempted to report this post to the moderators. Only because I think Jack might have the maths to tell us how likely Jorden was to achieve a 2840 TPR, and how likely that was to be enough to win the event. I assume he has a few days spare to satisfy my idle curiosity.

My own maths is enough to know that at the very least you need Magnus to be a bit off top form. But I'd think with Magnus, MVL, Fabi and Anish in the field you would probably expect at least one of them to score higher.

MartinCarpenter
Posts: 2713
Joined: Tue May 24, 2011 10:58 am

Re: Wijk aan Zee 2021

Post by MartinCarpenter » Fri Feb 05, 2021 4:03 pm

I think that sum is going to get frightening, because he only gets the 2840 performance by hurting some other people on the way....

Chris Rice
Posts: 3158
Joined: Thu Nov 08, 2012 5:17 am

Re: Wijk aan Zee 2021

Post by Chris Rice » Mon Mar 01, 2021 4:14 pm

The chief arbiter, Pavel Vortruba, at Wijk aan Zee wasn't happy with the way he was portrayed by the media and states that the video footage did not tell the full story of what happened. Here is his account of what happened off camera.

Kevin Thurlow
Posts: 4383
Joined: Wed Apr 30, 2008 12:28 pm

Re: Wijk aan Zee 2021

Post by Kevin Thurlow » Mon Mar 01, 2021 5:15 pm

Well, I agree that the timing of the play-off was bad (ok awful), but the arbiter knew that in advance, so he can hardly complain... He's entitled to defend himself, but his body language towards Alireza looked a bit aggressive at times. Players (even the calmest ones) will get wound up by interruptions like this.

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