Stavanger 15-26 June 2015

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Christopher Kreuzer
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Re: Stavanger 15-26 June 2015

Post by Christopher Kreuzer » Thu Jun 25, 2015 4:23 pm

Mick Norris wrote:Great result for Topalov +4

Anand will be pretty happy with +3

Both 2900+ performances

Live ratings - Anand up to no 2 at 2816.1, Topalov no 3 at 2816.0
Anand came close to setting a new best rating for himself (his best is 2817 from March 2011). Topalov has exceeded his past peak rating (which was 2813 in July 2006). Both were World Number 1 at the time they set those personal bests. That's a bit more difficult to do now, of course, as Carlsen has set the bar so high.

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Re: Stavanger 15-26 June 2015

Post by Mick Norris » Thu Jun 25, 2015 4:40 pm

Topalov set the 5th highest ever live rating during this tournament, peaking at 2821.2 on Tuesday, just ahead of Anand's peak of 2820.7 on 26 Jan 2011
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Re: Stavanger 15-26 June 2015

Post by Mike Truran » Thu Jun 25, 2015 6:19 pm

My "machine" comment is coming back to haunt me. Carlsen has gone off the rails completely today. :shock: :shock: :shock:

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Re: Stavanger 15-26 June 2015

Post by David Robertson » Thu Jun 25, 2015 6:21 pm

Well Hammered

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Re: Stavanger 15-26 June 2015

Post by Chris Rice » Thu Jun 25, 2015 7:13 pm

The last time Hammer beat Carlsen was 15 years ago in the Norwegian U-10 championship.

Round 9:
Aronian, Levon Nakamura, Hikaru 0-1
Caruana, Fabiano Giri, Anish ½-½
Hammer, Jon Ludvig Carlsen, Magnus 1-0
Topalov, Veselin Anand, Viswanathan ½-½
Vachier-Lagrave, Maxime Grischuk, Alexander ½-½

Final Standings :

1 Topalov 6.5
2= Anand, Nakamura 6
4 Giri 5.5
5= Caruana, Vachier-Lagrave 4
7= Carlsen, Grischuk 3.5
9= Aronian, Hammer 3

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Re: Stavanger 15-26 June 2015

Post by Mick Norris » Thu Jun 25, 2015 7:29 pm

Good result for Giri, puts him in the second rating spot for the Candidates
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Matt Mackenzie
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Re: Stavanger 15-26 June 2015

Post by Matt Mackenzie » Thu Jun 25, 2015 7:42 pm

That was an utter abomination from the world number 1 :shock:

Reminded me of Kramnik's horror against Fressinet a couple of years ago.
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Re: Stavanger 15-26 June 2015

Post by David Robertson » Thu Jun 25, 2015 8:04 pm

Has there been a worse overall tournament performance in modern times by a reigning WC? If so, which?

We'll doubtless be told that his Rd 1 cock-up knocked the stuffing out of him. But his frivolous play today suggests either a giant sulk; or a complete indifference. Sometimes he gives me the impression that he might one day shrug, and walk away from the game. I wonder if we're watching a hint of this, the week past

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Re: Stavanger 15-26 June 2015

Post by Mike Truran » Thu Jun 25, 2015 8:05 pm

He won't be world number 1 for much longer if he carries on playing like that.

5. ...f6? He should be ashamed of himself.

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Matt Mackenzie
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Re: Stavanger 15-26 June 2015

Post by Matt Mackenzie » Thu Jun 25, 2015 8:09 pm

David Robertson wrote:Has there been a worse overall tournament performance in modern times by a reigning WC? If so, which?
Anand had something similar (he may even have come bottom?) not long before losing his title? Or am I misremembering.......
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JustinHorton
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Re: Stavanger 15-26 June 2015

Post by JustinHorton » Thu Jun 25, 2015 9:21 pm

David Robertson wrote:Has there been a worse overall tournament performance in modern times by a reigning WC? If so, which?

We'll doubtless be told that his Rd 1 cock-up knocked the stuffing out of him. But his frivolous play today suggests either a giant sulk; or a complete indifference. Sometimes he gives me the impression that he might one day shrug, and walk away from the game. I wonder if we're watching a hint of this, the week past
He seems to lose a fair few games to players who are not in his class by playing ropey openings from which he never escapes. I can't think of another world champion who's played quite like that. My guess is that this suggests a motivation problem when playing people he doesn't think ought to test him.
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Re: Stavanger 15-26 June 2015

Post by David Sedgwick » Thu Jun 25, 2015 9:43 pm

David Robertson wrote:Has there been a worse overall tournament performance in modern times by a reigning WC? If so, which?

We'll doubtless be told that his Rd 1 cock-up knocked the stuffing out of him. But his frivolous play today suggests either a giant sulk; or a complete indifference. Sometimes he gives me the impression that he might one day shrug, and walk away from the game. I wonder if we're watching a hint of this, the week past
JustinHorton wrote:He seems to lose a fair few games to players who are not in his class by playing ropey openings from which he never escapes. I can't think of another world champion who's played quite like that. My guess is that this suggests a motivation problem when playing people he doesn't think ought to test him.
Carlsen's own reaction doesn't seem to bear out either David R's or Justin's comments:
Magnus Carlsen wrote:Finished Norway Chess with a loss to Jon Ludvig Hammer, congrats! Nothing went according to plan in this tournament. It's just extremely frustrating not to be able to show anything close to what I am capable of in my home country, making decisions during games that I cannot even explain to myself. Anyway, I have not lost belief in my ability to play chess and I hope neither have you guys! My next tournament will be in Saint Louis in August.

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Re: Stavanger 15-26 June 2015

Post by Roger de Coverly » Thu Jun 25, 2015 9:50 pm

David Sedgwick wrote: Carlsen's own reaction doesn't seem to bear out either David R's or Justin's comments:
If you were teaching someone openings, you would probably suggest that whilst after 1. d4 d5 2. c4 e6 3. Nf3 a6 was not the most mainstream of moves, the continuation 4. Bg5 was better met by 4. .. Be7 rather than 4. .. f6. But perhaps it was some crazy idea they had looked at together and disagreed on the assessment.

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JustinHorton
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Re: Stavanger 15-26 June 2015

Post by JustinHorton » Thu Jun 25, 2015 9:51 pm

David Sedgwick wrote:Carlsen's own reaction doesn't seem to bear out either David R's or Justin's comments
I don't think we would normally look to players' PR statements for a searching examination either of their performance or of their soul...
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Re: Stavanger 15-26 June 2015

Post by Jonathan Rogers » Thu Jun 25, 2015 10:00 pm

The criticisms made above of Carlsen (sometimes sulking, too little sense of danger against lesser players; and, I would add, often dubious choices of opening as well as poor opening knowlegde in itself) are valid. And they are not new. More generally he needs to find ways to motivate himself to improve (Kasparov says that he and Karpov were only able to improve/continue to develop because they had each other to play against!). But of course one possible consequence of a very bad result like this may precisely be that he will find that motivation. No doubt at all that he will be "back" and his tweet seems to me to strike the right note.

And indeed, when he plays in Norway, or for Norway, he seems to be about 2700, and otherwise abouut 2950. It must cause him some pain but it is hard to ignore the discrepancy.

Otherwise: Topalov was lucky overall to win it and Anand surely played better, but these things happen. Nakamura is to my mind developing credibility at the top of the table, it is no doubt a matter of great relief to Carlsen that he has mastered him. Giri, who has not (yet) been mastered by Carlsen, not even once, is not quite at the same level as Naka. Are Giri and Carlsen "not friends" by the way? Giri's constant barbs against Carlsen don't come across as friendly teasing.

Poor Aronian!

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