Beyond Material - Ignore the Face Value of Your Pieces

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JustinHorton
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Re: Beyond Material - Ignore the Face Value of Your Pieces

Post by JustinHorton » Wed Jul 14, 2021 9:39 pm

MJMcCready wrote:
Wed Jul 14, 2021 8:43 pm
If you look at the format and layout of 'Soviet Chess' it has the pretensions of an academic text and the bibliography is extensive and suggestive.
So he doesn't actually "pass himself off as an academic" at all
"Do you play chess?"
"Yes, but I prefer a game with a better chance of cheating."

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NickFaulks
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Re: Beyond Material - Ignore the Face Value of Your Pieces

Post by NickFaulks » Wed Jul 14, 2021 9:47 pm

MJMcCready wrote:
Wed Jul 14, 2021 8:43 pm
As mentioned, GMs are very good to chess but should stick to that.
Andy might be troubled if he learned of your opinion that he really should have abandoned his full time career as a journalist when he got his GM title. But probably not much.
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Matt Mackenzie
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Re: Beyond Material - Ignore the Face Value of Your Pieces

Post by Matt Mackenzie » Wed Jul 14, 2021 10:18 pm

The funny thing about Soltis is that he *has* written some real potboilers amongst the good stuff.

But that has nothing to do with any meme that "he should have stuck to chess".
"Set up your attacks so that when the fire is out, it isn't out!" (H N Pillsbury)

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MJMcCready
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Re: Beyond Material - Ignore the Face Value of Your Pieces

Post by MJMcCready » Wed Jul 14, 2021 11:21 pm

NickFaulks wrote:
Wed Jul 14, 2021 9:47 pm
MJMcCready wrote:
Wed Jul 14, 2021 8:43 pm
As mentioned, GMs are very good to chess but should stick to that.
Andy might be troubled if he learned of your opinion that he really should have abandoned his full time career as a journalist when he got his GM title. But probably not much.
Well, I can't comment on his function as a journalist but when he delves into historical matters at length and publishes literature based on historical matters all he does is show the world that he isn't an academic. Like I said, just read that Introduction to Soviet Chess, he gives himself away in that alone. Why on earth he starts accusing the Soviets as being the world's biggest liars and much worse in it I don't know, only he can answer that. I'm not quite sure where this thread is going. I thought that if you have a profession and excel in that you should stick to that. It doesn't just follow that if you are good at one thing you will be good at another with an altogether different skill set. GMs are good are playing chess but it doesn't follow that they make for great writers or are likely to ever become one. Some have much writing ability, Rowson is an obvious example, but I thought he's in the minority.

I bought this a few years back and thought it was criminal. The English was very poor indeed and it was full of ridiculous claims like all world champions are practitioners of the French Defence and Carlsen was no exception, just put in there to sell the book along with many things that any experienced chess player could tell you is a load poppycock. It gave me the impression that the authors were good at chess but only that. In the end I threw it away. I thought if New In Chess will publish that, then they will publish anything.
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Last edited by MJMcCready on Thu Jul 15, 2021 1:11 am, edited 3 times in total.

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MJMcCready
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Re: Beyond Material - Ignore the Face Value of Your Pieces

Post by MJMcCready » Wed Jul 14, 2021 11:39 pm

JustinHorton wrote:
Wed Jul 14, 2021 9:39 pm
MJMcCready wrote:
Wed Jul 14, 2021 8:43 pm
If you look at the format and layout of 'Soviet Chess' it has the pretensions of an academic text and the bibliography is extensive and suggestive.
So he doesn't actually "pass himself off as an academic" at all
He passes himself off as someone with a great interest in Soviet chess, and a GM with some writing ability but not someone with an academic interest in his subject matter.

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Matt Mackenzie
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Re: Beyond Material - Ignore the Face Value of Your Pieces

Post by Matt Mackenzie » Thu Jul 15, 2021 12:07 am

MJMcCready wrote:
Wed Jul 14, 2021 11:39 pm
JustinHorton wrote:
Wed Jul 14, 2021 9:39 pm
MJMcCready wrote:
Wed Jul 14, 2021 8:43 pm
If you look at the format and layout of 'Soviet Chess' it has the pretensions of an academic text and the bibliography is extensive and suggestive.
So he doesn't actually "pass himself off as an academic" at all
He passes himself off as someone with a great interest in Soviet chess, and a GM with some writing ability but not someone with an academic interest in his subject matter.
And how have you determined that is not actually true?
"Set up your attacks so that when the fire is out, it isn't out!" (H N Pillsbury)

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MJMcCready
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Re: Beyond Material - Ignore the Face Value of Your Pieces

Post by MJMcCready » Thu Jul 15, 2021 12:35 am

What interest he has in Soviet Chess cannot be determined from that publication alone although it can be assumed he went to great lengths writing it. He came across as being passionate about the subject matter although speaking as an academic, why he would present content with a model of history which is older than the content itself, devoid of methodology, and lacking discourse (which is what academic history is essentially) is another matter. From an academic perspective, and not that of a chess-lover, I found it to be uncritical and symptomatic of its genre. Those who love chess and are historians by profession, such as Tim Harding on this forum, make for better reading by far. Sadly, he hasn't turned his hand to Soviet Chess in terms of a publication.

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JustinHorton
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Re: Beyond Material - Ignore the Face Value of Your Pieces

Post by JustinHorton » Thu Jul 15, 2021 8:48 am

MJMcCready wrote:
Wed Jul 14, 2021 11:21 pm
I bought this a few years back and thought it was criminal. The English was very poor indeed and it was full of ridiculous claims like all world champions are practitioners of the French Defence
Where does it say that then
"Do you play chess?"
"Yes, but I prefer a game with a better chance of cheating."

lostontime.blogspot.com

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John Upham
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Re: Beyond Material - Ignore the Face Value of Your Pieces

Post by John Upham » Thu Jul 15, 2021 9:13 am

MJMcCready wrote:
Wed Jul 14, 2021 7:32 pm
my background is academia, where there are measure in place to stop that from happening.
Presumably this is yourself :

https://engineering.nd.edu/faculty/mark-mccready/
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Nick Burrows
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Re: Beyond Material - Ignore the Face Value of Your Pieces

Post by Nick Burrows » Thu Jul 15, 2021 10:35 am

John Upham wrote:
Thu Jul 15, 2021 9:13 am

Presumably this is yourself :

https://engineering.nd.edu/faculty/mark-mccready/
I'm tempted to suggest he should stick to reviewing books on engineering :lol:

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Re: Beyond Material - Ignore the Face Value of Your Pieces

Post by Nick Burrows » Thu Jul 15, 2021 10:42 am

MJMcCready wrote:
Wed Jul 14, 2021 11:21 pm

was full of ridiculous claims like all world champions are practitioners of the French Defence and Carlsen was no exception, just put in there to sell the book along with many things that any experienced chess player could tell you is a load of poppycock.
https://www.chessgames.com/perl/chessgame?gid=1570776

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MJMcCready
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Re: Beyond Material - Ignore the Face Value of Your Pieces

Post by MJMcCready » Thu Jul 15, 2021 7:27 pm

I know he occasionally plays it but it doesn't make him a practitioner. You need to read the book to capture the sense in which an occasional game by the current world champion was used to promote their own publication.

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Re: Beyond Material - Ignore the Face Value of Your Pieces

Post by Paul Cooksey » Thu Jul 15, 2021 7:45 pm

I have not read this book, but like another of Kuljasevic's which I'll mention in another thread.

I did like the Modern French. I agree there are issues with the translation. But I knew more about the French defence when I'd finished. That seems to me a better criteria for judging the success of an opening book than the elegance of the prose.

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JustinHorton
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Re: Beyond Material - Ignore the Face Value of Your Pieces

Post by JustinHorton » Thu Jul 15, 2021 9:55 pm

MJMcCready wrote:
Thu Jul 15, 2021 7:27 pm
You need to read the book to capture the sense in which an occasional game by the current world champion was used to promote their own publication.
Once again:
JustinHorton wrote:
Thu Jul 15, 2021 8:48 am
MJMcCready wrote:
Wed Jul 14, 2021 11:21 pm
it was full of ridiculous claims like all world champions are practitioners of the French Defence
Where does it say that then
"Do you play chess?"
"Yes, but I prefer a game with a better chance of cheating."

lostontime.blogspot.com

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MJMcCready
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Re: Beyond Material - Ignore the Face Value of Your Pieces

Post by MJMcCready » Thu Jul 15, 2021 10:41 pm

It says it in the Foreword:

The French has been an integral part of many top players’ repertoires and it was the key weapon in the hands of old masters such as Botvinnik and contemporary stars such as Carlsen and Morozevich. When you look at their tournament results, it becomes clear that they chose the French Defence in important games, when they need to secure a win with the black pieces.’

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