Brian Eley

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JustinHorton
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Re: Brian Eley

Post by JustinHorton » Wed Aug 03, 2022 10:45 am

Mmm, but in fact enquiries into historic abuse do happen don't they
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Andrew Zigmond
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Re: Brian Eley

Post by Andrew Zigmond » Wed Aug 03, 2022 10:45 am

JustinHorton wrote:
Wed Aug 03, 2022 10:40 am
MJMcCready wrote:
Wed Aug 03, 2022 10:29 am
Well, the problem is that prior to Saville's revalations, such crimes were going unpunished
The "Savile revelations" came after his death
There were rumours about Saville for many years and he had been interviewed under caution by the police at least once. What nobody knew was the true scale of his activity and just how many victims there were.
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MJMcCready
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Re: Brian Eley

Post by MJMcCready » Wed Aug 03, 2022 10:48 am

JustinHorton wrote:
Wed Aug 03, 2022 10:40 am
MJMcCready wrote:
Wed Aug 03, 2022 10:29 am
Well, the problem is that prior to Saville's revalations, such crimes were going unpunished
The "Savile revelations" came after his death
Yes I know but it is something that is more likely to be spoken about or reported now.

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MJMcCready
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Re: Brian Eley

Post by MJMcCready » Wed Aug 03, 2022 10:49 am

Andrew Zigmond wrote:
Wed Aug 03, 2022 10:45 am
JustinHorton wrote:
Wed Aug 03, 2022 10:40 am
MJMcCready wrote:
Wed Aug 03, 2022 10:29 am
Well, the problem is that prior to Saville's revalations, such crimes were going unpunished
The "Savile revelations" came after his death
There were rumours about Saville for many years and he had been interviewed under caution by the police at least once. What nobody knew was the true scale of his activity and just how many victims there were.
Well, speak to anyone from Leeds and they will tell you. My friend from there said that even in the 70s nurses used to tell the children to pretend to be asleep when he came.

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MJMcCready
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Re: Brian Eley

Post by MJMcCready » Wed Aug 03, 2022 10:50 am

Ok, so I have sent a long enough email to Panorama, outlining the major points. If they reply I will post what they say.

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MJMcCready
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Re: Brian Eley

Post by MJMcCready » Wed Aug 03, 2022 10:52 am

Andrew Zigmond wrote:
Wed Aug 03, 2022 10:45 am
JustinHorton wrote:
Wed Aug 03, 2022 10:40 am
MJMcCready wrote:
Wed Aug 03, 2022 10:29 am
Well, the problem is that prior to Saville's revalations, such crimes were going unpunished
The "Savile revelations" came after his death
There were rumours about Saville for many years and he had been interviewed under caution by the police at least once. What nobody knew was the true scale of his activity and just how many victims there were.
Well by police yes but he also had local police on his payroll. He was also interviewed publicly on tv in the 90s, and as much as I loathe to admit it, you have to admire the way he handled it. One of the major hurdles regarding Saville was he was entrusted by the royal family so much, so that made him off limits to a lot of people, even though suspicions continued on and on and on...

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Re: Brian Eley

Post by Andrew Zigmond » Wed Aug 03, 2022 11:02 am

I don't want to get sidetracked but the Saville scandal was a very complex affair and, once it was finally out in the open, there was a lot to unpick. It's not something that can be summarised in a few paragraphs so I don't intend to try. The key point, and relevant to Eley as well, was that attitudes and understanding were different in the 1970s and 80s, there are safeguards in place now that weren't there then and also electronic communication allows dots to be joined more effectively.
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Angus French
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Re: Brian Eley

Post by Angus French » Wed Aug 03, 2022 11:07 am

MJMcCready wrote:
Wed Aug 03, 2022 10:52 am
Andrew Zigmond wrote:
Wed Aug 03, 2022 10:45 am
JustinHorton wrote:
Wed Aug 03, 2022 10:40 am


The "Savile revelations" came after his death
There were rumours about Saville for many years and he had been interviewed under caution by the police at least once. What nobody knew was the true scale of his activity and just how many victims there were.
Well by police yes but he also had local police on his payroll. He was also interviewed publicly on tv in the 90s, and as much as I loathe to admit it, you have to admire the way he handled it. One of the major hurdles regarding Saville was he was entrusted by the royal family so much, so that made him off limits to a lot of people, even though suspicions continued on and on and on...
It's Savile, with one 'l'.

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JustinHorton
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Re: Brian Eley

Post by JustinHorton » Wed Aug 03, 2022 11:12 am

Andrew Zigmond wrote:
Wed Aug 03, 2022 11:02 am
The key point, and relevant to Eley as well, was that attitudes and understanding were different in the 1970s and 80s, there are safeguards in place now that weren't there then and also electronic communication allows dots to be joined more effectively.
And yet scandals do continue to occur, and this may be because all the safeguards in the world may have no effect if institutions are disinclined to act or to scrutinise themselves.
"Do you play chess?"
"Yes, but I prefer a game with a better chance of cheating."

lostontime.blogspot.com

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MJMcCready
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Re: Brian Eley

Post by MJMcCready » Wed Aug 03, 2022 11:18 am

Most likely yes but social media is changing things and everyone has a voice on multiple platforms now. How much it's changing things is another question.

Mick Norris
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Re: Brian Eley

Post by Mick Norris » Wed Aug 03, 2022 11:41 am

Ian Thompson wrote:
Wed Aug 03, 2022 10:30 am
JustinHorton wrote:
Tue Aug 02, 2022 3:23 pm
3. Email from Julian to myself, 19 July. Copied to Mike Truran. (Header: Safeguarding Legacy Matters.)
Dear Justin

...

we do not as a volunteer organisation have the resources to carry out an internal investigation of the kind you suggest, nor the financial resources for an independent investigation.

...

Julian
The Board could say that it would cost £X to conduct an investigation which would have to be paid for by an increase in membership fees of £Y. What's the likelihood of Council agreeing to that?
That's an interesting observation Ian; it would be possible, of course, for a motion to be put to Council at the AGM to set this out and see if Council want to proceed

Julian is correct that there's unlikely to be suitably qualified people willing to volunteer to do an internal investigation, and I'd imagine even if there were, some would prefer an independent investigation

It has been good that Justin has taken the time to ask the question and get permission to publish the response
Any postings on here represent my personal views

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MJMcCready
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Re: Brian Eley

Post by MJMcCready » Wed Aug 03, 2022 11:50 am

It would have to be independent.

Kevin Thurlow
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Re: Brian Eley

Post by Kevin Thurlow » Wed Aug 03, 2022 12:26 pm

"It would have to be independent."

Yes. I have been told there were over 60 complaints against Eley. However, one case is too many.

It is probably up to the complainants to try to complain again, which would doubtless be tough. Some of them are no longer alive, in some cases in especially tragic circumstances.

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MJMcCready
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Re: Brian Eley

Post by MJMcCready » Wed Aug 03, 2022 12:29 pm

I know of one who simply won't talk about it and it's been like that since the 80s. I don't think he will.

Andrew Zigmond
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Re: Brian Eley

Post by Andrew Zigmond » Wed Aug 03, 2022 12:43 pm

Has anybody considered the point that Eley's victims have spent thirty years with the possibility of a criminal trial hanging over them? Obviously it became less likely with each year that passed but for a long time there must have been the very real likelihood that any day they could receive the news that Eley had been apprehended and would be returned to the UK to face justice. That would have meant disruption to lives they were trying to get on with and we know that, even now, victims of alleged sexual abusers are not treated well in court.

I can't speak for Eley's victims. Some might now welcome the opportunity for their voices to be heard, particularly as I suspect many were likely not believed at the time. For others, even mention of his name might stir up memories they are trying to forget.

So I stand by my point that an enquiry would produce few meaningful recommendations and while it might hold a few people to account for looking the other way, those people are unlikely now to hold positions of authority.

Justin - I know we have no particular reason to like each other but you are, I believe, an investigative journalist by profession. Perhaps you could write the definitive story of the scandal with those who are willing to talk and then it could be taken from there.
Controller - Yorkshire League
Chairman - Harrogate Chess Club
All views expressed entirely my own