Postal Votes in our elections

[Peter D Williams]

Morning all hope you are all well and enjoying this sunshine

According to my research people who have a postal vote are far likely to use it and vote for one of the 3 main party's.What do people think of overseas postal votes?Are enough checks done?
I know that the libdems are very good at getting out their postal vote and the Labour party is to.
Postal voting is so open to fraud that international observers who monitor suspicious elections in Eastern Europe have called on the Government to take urgent action.Officials from the Warsaw-based Office for Democratic Institutions and Human Rights said they had "serious concerns"l elections would be tainted by ballot-rigging.
In 2008 On Tuesday, Richard Mawrey QC convicted a Tory Councillor of carrying out a postal vote fraud to ensure he was voted into office.Eshaq Khan and his electoral team created hundreds of false names in the run-up to last year's elections and entered them on the electoral roll.

They then made postal vote applications for these "ghost voters" and used the ballots to back Mr Khan.

Mr Mawrey said the guilty verdict showed that fraud was now "both easy and profitable".

We must be very vigilant and report at once any concerns we have about postal vote fraud

Right time for coffee

[John McKenna]

Voting fraud is, of course, common practice in many foreign countries that the British formerly ruled and we should expect it here increasingly due to the project of successive governments since WW II to recreate the British Empire in the UK. They never lost their fondness for employing and ruling their overseas minions so import them in sufficient numbers to perpetuate the Empire through their sham apology for it - the 'Commonwealth'. That word was deliberately chosen to help obliterate any lingering memory of the true original Commonwealth of Cromwell.

[Peter D Williams]

The next election could be decided by postal votes of people living aboard.It is very easy to sign people up to postal votes. I know the Lib/Dems and Labour are very good at this.Old people may prefer a postal vote saves walking to the polling booth.

Bye until tomorrow.

[Paul McKeown]

Most recent case of candidate convicted of electoral fraud: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-kent-21387179

Err. A Tory.

[Paul McKeown]

Oh and what happened with Michael Mates? Can't recall having heard whether the authorities decided to prosecute or not.

[Rob Thompson]

Mr Mawrey said the guilty verdict showed that fraud was now "both easy and profitable".

I don't understand this. Surely voting fraud could be said to be easy and profitable if you get away with it, not if you're convicted?

[John McKenna]

Rob, he was unlucky enough to get caught - how many avoid detection?
What I don't understand is how a someone with what sounds like a name of Turkish origin gets to stand in any UK election. Turkey was never part of the Empire. The answer is possibly that he is a Turkish Cypriot - the island of Cyprus was somehow acquired by the British in 1878, I believe, gained independece around 1958 and soon became a nation divided against itself (a common legacy of British rule) - if so in addition to his prison sentence he should be deported from whence he came. Of course his right to a family life will probably trump that, particularly as he has such an extended 'family' living in his numerous properties. If he was born here he cannot be deported but there should be a ban on him standing for office for a longer period of time than 12 months. I await the day when the prison population get to elect their own MP (after all they are numerous enough to be a constituency) from their ranks. Hopefully someone on a community sentence since they will be able to serve it in Parliament. If not I am sure a video link can be arranged.

[IM Jack Rudd]

What I don't understand is how a someone with what sounds like a name of Turkish origin gets to stand in any UK election.

It's a local council election; there's no nationality test for that. Even if there were, it's perfectly possible for someone to have a Turkish name and be a British citizen.

[John McKenna]

So, Jack, are you saying there is no nationality test to stand in a local election while there is to vote in all elections?
To vote one must be on the Register of Electors and the following applies -
People must register at the address they are resident at - that's a residence qualification.
And, are entitled to vote only if they are Briish, Irish, EU or qualifying Commonwealth citizens - a nationality qualification.
Do agree with your other point - it is perfectly possible for someone of any nationality to acquire British citizenship because our rulers have made it so. That is why I hold my own so cheap. And, before you possibly respond with the stock reply - why not f-off then - my response is - I was born here.

[IM Jack Rudd]

Hmmm, a different page I found from the same site suggests that even for local council elections, there's a requirement to be an EU or Commonwealth citizen to stand.

(The other half of my comment still applies, though: you can't deduce his citizenship from his name.)

[Peter D Williams]

Oh and what happened with Michael Mates? Can't recall having heard whether the authorities decided to prosecute or not.

Morning all
What do you mean what happened to Michael Mates? do you mean this Michael Mates has been reported to Hampshire Constabulary for Electoral Fraud under the Fraud Act 2006 by competitor Don Jerrard who is standing for the Justice and Anti-Corruption Party.[11] The former lawyer wrote to the county’s Chief Constable claiming Mr Mates breached the 2006 Fraud Act by giving his address as a house where he rents rooms in Winchester. Parallel to this, Hampshire police confirmed two complaints of alleged racist language in Michael Mates' Election Statement[12] were passed to the Thames Valley Police for investigation.[13] Thames Valley Police are said to be getting ready to interview Mr Mates, but it is not known whether this will be done under caution. Michael Mates has denied the allegations, claiming he is the victim of a smear campaign.[14] or this Mates is also known for his affiliation to disgraced former business tycoon Asil Nadir and the Polly Peck Empire.[6] In the 1990s, when a junior minister in the Northern Ireland Office, Mates expressed his support for Nadir by infamously sending him a watch inscribed with the words 'don't let the buggers get you down'- a reference to an ongoing investigation into Nadir's fraudulent financial activities by British authorities.

[Rob Thompson]

John, you seem to be suggesting that it's a bad thing that people can gain citizenship, and I'm not sure why you would think this.

[Peter D Williams]

I don't understand this. Surely voting fraud could be said to be easy and profitable if you get away with it, not if you're convicted?

This was reported in the Guardian in 2010
Police have received at least 50 complaints about serious voter fraud in advance of this week's elections amid warnings that the rapid rise of postal voting is making the system vulnerable to abuse.

Accusations range from political activists putting pressure on people to mark their party's box on the postal vote form, to phantom voters being registered by candidates and their supporters to farm votes. The problems have emerged before most postal votes have been returned.

Most of the alleged abuses relate to the council elections in England, which coincide with the general election.

In London the Metropolitan police have received 28 complaints across 12 boroughs and launched five investigations – one in Ealing and four in Tower Hamlets, which has a history of problems with electoral fraud. In Tower Hamlets the allegations are understood to relate to the registration of up to 10 "ghost voters" at single addresses where the residents have no knowledge of the names on the electoral roll. George Galloway's Respect party has complained that opponents are interfering with postal voters.

West Yorkshire police have received 19 complaints and launched five investigations.

This was said by John Turner, chief executive of the Association of Electoral Administrators, said the system was vulnerable because people did not have to provide identification when they registered for postal votes.

We must be ever vigilant to postal vote fraud and report any concerns we have to the authority's

Right time for coffee.

[John McKenna]

Rob, don't get me wrong. I am not against people gaining British citizenship, however, I am against giving it away in an unbridled manner to all and sundry in a process of mass immigration that includes the illegals and those of dubious legality. In this the UK is acting as if it is the US but this country is not a vast continental landmass it is a small, densely-populated island. I hope that one day the inequalities in this world will all have been eliminated and all borders vanish as a consequence but having an open-door policy now is asking for trouble and will not solve the problem of the impoverished nations whose people should be helped as much as possible by developed nations AND most of all by their own goverments to remain citizens of their own country. Instead those governments all too often treat their people like dirt and simply rip them off then salt their ill gotten gains away in dictator-friendly banks. Why is our government on such splendid terms with their 'Commomwealth' counterparts and still donating 'aid' to them? My answer is because the wealthy of the world really are all in it together.

(Edit: For all its faults, I believe the chess world is far closer to being united than the real one because all players, no matter how diverse, truly share a common interest in the game. What is our common interest in the real world?)

I am also opposed to dual nationality as it is fundamentally inequitable and we should all have just one nationality until such time as nationality is rundant because all have become equal citizens of a united world.

[Rob Thompson]

Rob, don't get me wrong. I am not against people gaining British citizenship, however, I am against giving it away in an unbridled manner to all and sundry in a process of mass immigration that includes the illegals and those of dubious legality.

Citation needed.

In this the UK is acting as if it is the US

Do you have any idea of how the USA treats immigrants?

but this country is not a vast continental landmass it is a small, densely-populated island. I hope that one day the inequalities in this world will all have been eliminated and all borders vanish as a consequence but having an open-door policy now is asking for trouble and will not solve the problem of the impoverished nations whose people should be helped as much as possible by developed nations AND most of all by their own governments to remain citizens of their own country. Instead those governments all too often treat their people like dirt and simply rip them off then salt their ill gotten gains away in dictator-friendly banks.

Well this all seems like a non-sequitur.

Why is our government on such splendid terms with their 'Commonwealth' counterparts and still donating 'aid' to them? My answer is because the wealthy of the world really are all in it together.

Because it is largely because of us that many commonwealth countries have many of the problems that they do. Before the UK invaded, India was as developed as the UK. By the time the British forces left it is clear that that was no longer the case. The wealthy of the world to a large degree are in it together, but this is a completely separate issue to either immigration or foreign aid.

(Edit: For all its faults, I believe the chess world is far closer to being united than the real one because all players, no matter how diverse, truly share a common interest in the game. What is our common interest in the real world?)

I am also opposed to dual nationality as it is fundamentally inequitable and we should all have just one nationality until such time as nationality is redundant because all have become equal citizens of a united world.

Seriously, on that last part, what the hell? I just can't see how you've come to that conclusion, or even why it's an issue for you. Why are you concerned by dual nationality?