Nigel Short appointment

[NickFaulks]

Ok, here's my recollection. If I am completely wrong about everything, then I'm sorry and, in the nature of this forum, I expect someone will give a better account or even a link.

They were doing a two-handed commentary on a highly technical ending which Jon was one of a handful of people in the world able to understand. He was cogitating hard. Cathy, a seasoned broadcaster who knew that the one thing you cannot have on radio is dead air, made some vacuous comment to fill the space. Jon said something like "shut up Cathy, I'm trying to think" - just as he would in normal life. No problem, except that the usual people who like to take offence did so.

Does this remind anyone of anything, and did it actually happen?

[Matt Mackenzie]

Well my response there is roughly "is that it?"

Pretty weaksauce, if so.

[Chris Goodall]

Short wrote something that was widely considered sexist, but is arguing it is not because he does not accept that definition of sexism.

The idea that Short is sexist is obviously a useful one to many people. Rita Atkins's response to Short stood out to me: she said it wasn't that boys and girls had different brains, it was just that boys tended to be more competitive at an early age. I assume her pupils keep their competitiveness in a different part of their body than their brains, because on the face of it she is agreeing with him.

In fact, when you survey people who claim to oppose sexism, a clear majority also believe that one advantage of replacing men with women in leadership roles is that women are better able to empathise with the people their decisions affect. Contradiction there, surely?

[Kevin Thurlow]

"Does this remind anyone of anything, and did it actually happen?"

Yes - I think it was the TV coverage of Kasparov - Short. Cathy looked rather cross, but obviously did not bear a grudge. I think she got much worse treatment on other occasions.

[Thomas Rendle]

Short wrote something that was widely considered sexist, but is arguing it is not because he does not accept that definition of sexism.

The idea that Short is sexist is obviously a useful one to many people. Rita Atkins's response to Short stood out to me: she said it wasn't that boys and girls had different brains, it was just that boys tended to be more competitive at an early age. I assume her pupils keep their competitiveness in a different part of their body than their brains, because on the face of it she is agreeing with him.

In fact, when you survey people who claim to oppose sexism, a clear majority also believe that one advantage of replacing men with women in leadership roles is that women are better able to empathise with the people their decisions affect. Contradiction there, surely?

I guess not everyone is aware of Nigel's reputation, and I'd recommend checking out the twitter reaction to his appointment to those that can (including Greg Shahade's response). I think you'd struggle to find a top level player in England who isn't aware of his reputation - and those I have heard defending him would say "it's just Nigel being Nigel". Since I don't have much first hand knowledge that's all I will say, but dozens upon dozens of stories (2nd hand) paint a pretty clear picture.

[JustinHorton]

Shahade

[Matt Bridgeman]

Greg’s three word summation of ‘total unrepentant creep’ seems to nail it for me!

[NickFaulks]

Contradiction there, surely?

I remember hearing a senior executive in the publishing industry say that there was absolutely no inequality there, in fact the women earned more than the men. She sounded completely serious.

[Chris Goodall]

I guess not everyone is aware of Nigel's reputation, and I'd recommend checking out the twitter reaction to his appointment to those that can (including Greg Shahade's response). I think you'd struggle to find a top level player in England who isn't aware of his reputation - and those I have heard defending him would say "it's just Nigel being Nigel". Since I don't have much first hand knowledge that's all I will say, but dozens upon dozens of stories (2nd hand) paint a pretty clear picture.

Thanks Thomas. Please don't take anything I said as a blanket endorsement of Nigel! It's clear from the "totty" piece and from "T.D.F." and from his Miles obituary that Nigel has a rare talent for cocksmanship.

I don't even know if Nigel is right about biology. I know that when we went to school in the 90s, it was taught as fact that boys would emerge from puberty with better spatial reasoning and girls with better verbal. And I know that there's a strong social desirability effect when it comes to statements about gendered brains - people know what answer they're expected to give, even if it contradicts the answer they gave to a slightly different question.

[Matt Bridgeman]

I guess not everyone is aware of Nigel's reputation, and I'd recommend checking out the twitter reaction to his appointment to those that can (including Greg Shahade's response). I think you'd struggle to find a top level player in England who isn't aware of his reputation - and those I have heard defending him would say "it's just Nigel being Nigel". Since I don't have much first hand knowledge that's all I will say, but dozens upon dozens of stories (2nd hand) paint a pretty clear picture.

Thanks Thomas. Please don't take anything I said as a blanket endorsement of Nigel! It's clear from the "totty" piece and from "T.D.F." and from his Miles obituary that Nigel has a rare talent for cocksmanship.

I don't even know if Nigel is right about biology. I know that when we went to school in the 90s, it was taught as fact that boys would emerge from puberty with better spatial reasoning and girls with better verbal. And I know that there's a strong social desirability effect when it comes to statements about gendered brains - people know what answer they're expected to give, even if it contradicts other parts of their worldview.

I think that’s all pretty irrelevant if he’s going around perving over 15 year old girls, as Greg suggests he was. Education and world views, who gives a s**t!

[NickFaulks]

Shahade

Immediately above, Peter Heine Nielsen makes an ass of himself by thinking that Iashvili is Azmaiparashvili.

[Chris Goodall]

I think that’s all pretty irrelevant if he’s going around perving over 15 year old girls, as Greg suggests he was. Education and world views, who gives a s**t!

That's kind of my point, isn't it? People's reactions to Nigel's article are really reactions to Nigel. Who cares what he actually said?

[Chris Goodall]

Shahade

Immediately above, Peter Heine Nielsen makes an ass of himself by thinking that Iashvili is Azmaiparashvili.

That thread is a depressing reflection on chess players' black and white thinking. You're either anti-Short and you believe every allegation large or small, or you're a Short "defender" and you believe none of them.

The line between good and evil passes through every human heart, etc.

[Gerard Killoran]

I don't even know if Nigel is right about biology.

No, he's completely wrong. He cherry-picked a single, dubious study and misquoted the findings

[/quote] I know that when we went to school in the 90s, it was taught as fact that boys would emerge from puberty with better spatial reasoning and girls with better verbal. And I know that there's a strong social desirability effect when it comes to statements about gendered brains - people know what answer they're expected to give, even if it contradicts the answer they gave to a slightly different question.
[/quote]

Did you go to school with Nigel? And what sort of school was it?

[Alistair Campbell]

"Does this remind anyone of anything, and did it actually happen?"

Yes - I think it was the TV coverage of Kasparov - Short. Cathy looked rather cross, but obviously did not bear a grudge. I think she got much worse treatment on other occasions.

My recollection is that there was some sort of consultation game broadcast between Short and Kasparov on the one hand and the Channel 4 team on the other. i think Carol Vorderman was entrusted to make the actual moves for the C4 team. At one point it was suggested she distract the opposition by tending to her make-up. I think Short joked about how well his side was doing given neither was FIDE graded (having been kicked off the list). At one point it was suggested that should time become an issue, consultation would cease and Speelman would play all the moves himself.

My further recollection is that it was during this consultation that it was felt that Cathy's suggestions were unhelpful and she was told to "shut up. Mind you, that must be nearly 30 years ago now so I may have got mixed up.