Remembering Cecil Valentine De Vere (14-ii-1846 09-ii-1875)

[John Upham]

Remembering Cecil Valentine De Vere (14-ii-1846 09-ii-1875)

https://britishchessnews.com/2020/02/14 ... 9-ii-1875/

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[John Townsend]

Was Baden Baden a boozing contest?

" ... but was much outdistanced by Blackburne who came third with 3.5 more pints than De Vere."

[John Upham]

Was Baden Baden a boozing contest?

" ... but was much outdistanced by Blackburne who came third with 3.5 more pints than De Vere."

Corrected. Ironically CdV, by all accounts, consumed far too much alcohol for his own good.

[David Sedgwick]

John U, I think that there is a mistake in the heading.

There, and in references to it, you give De Vere's date of birth as 14th February 1846, but the sources which you quote all say 14th February 1845.

Was he named Valentine because he was born on 14th February?

[John Upham]

John U, I think that there is a mistake in the heading.

There, and in references to it, you give De Vere's date of birth as 14th February 1846, but the sources which you quote all say 14th February 1845.

Was he named Valentine because he was born on 14th February?

Jon D'Souza-Eva has written to BCN confirming 1846 and that the quoted sources were in error (which I already knew).

Almost certainly a case of secondary sources such as Sunnucks not checking with primary sources which is so much easier in this day and age.

J.

[John Townsend]

It has been known for about 20 years that 14 February 1846 is the correct date, a fact that was established by Owen Hindle.

Sources need to be examined critically, not just repeated.

[John Upham]

It has been known for about 20 years that 14 February 1846 is the correct date, a fact that was established by Owen Hindle.

Sources need to be examined critically, not just repeated.

JDSE today wrote to BCN as follows:

"Hi John,

Valentine John Cecil De Vere Mathews was born illegitimately to Katherine Mathews in 1846. I think she claimed the father of the child was William Cecil De Vere (1823-1869), hence the reason she included "De Vere" in the child's names.
I've attached what few sources there are to this page on the marvellous Family Search website:
https://www.familysearch.org/tree/perso ... s/GWC9-3GW
I also included what John Townsend and others discovered.

I've spent some time trying to find Cecil De Vere in the 1871 census, but without success so far. I don't suppose it will contain any new information, but you never know.

As for "Brown" - this seems to have been used by De Vere some time after his mother's death. Perhaps that was the name of his real father? I guess I ought to be looking for "Cecil Brown" in the 1871 census, though with such a common surname that could be a long and fruitless task.

This page has lots of useful information, all of it correct as far as I can tell!
https://mannchess.org.uk/People/De%20Ve ... entine.htm

All the best,

Jon
"

[John Townsend]

Regarding the mention of William Cecil de Vere (above), my article in CHESS, May 2015, pages 38-39, proved that he was not the father, and there is no evidence that "she claimed the father of the child was William Cecil De Vere".

Use of the name of Brown is unexplained. As far as I know, it was only used on the death certificate and in the burial register.

[David Sedgwick]

Thank you to both John U and John T for the explanations.

[John Upham]

I have updated the BCN article and incorporated evidence quoted by Chris Ravilious in


British Chess Magazine, Volume CXXVI (125, 2005), Number 11 (November), page 610:

In Quote and Query #5741

In full:

From British Chess Magazine, Volume CXXVI (125, 2005), Number 11 (November), page 610:

In Quote and Query #5741 Chris Ravilious wrote:

“When writing their “The English Morphy? The Life and Games of Cecil De Vere (2001)” Owen Hindle and Bob Jones faced some intractable difficulties. Where and in what year was De Vere born? What was his baptismal name? What could be established regarding his parentage and early life? On several of these topics they achieved significant progress but lacunae remained. The absence of a birth certificate was a particular cause for regret.

Owen’s researchers into De Vere’s background have continued and he has now made two further discoveries, the first being the 1861 census entry for 10 Lower Calthorpe Street, St Pancras. This lists Katherine De Vere (Cecil’s mother, aged 36 and born in Wales: her forename was previously uncertain), a 15-year old ‘C.V. De Vere’, a house servant and a lodger. Cecil, employed as a clerk to a West India merchant, is stated to have been born in ‘St Georges’, Middlesex, presumably the parish of St George’s adjacent to Hyde Park.

Owen’s second breakthrough came with the discovery of the elusive birth certificate. From this we learnt Valentine John Cecil De Vere was born on St. Valentine’s Day 1846 (not 1845 as some sources have suggested), at 46 Warwick Street, just to the east of Regent Street. (While not in St George’s Parish, Warwick Street is near enough for the divergence between this and the census return to be readily explicable) Valentine’s mother’s name is entered as Catherine Matthews and by a clerical slip-up the same appellation appears under ‘name of father’, where it has been crossed through and replaced by a mysterious ‘No. 12’ plus the registrars initials. ‘Occupation of father’ is entered as ‘surgeon’.

J.