ECF AGM 2022

Debate directly related to English Chess Federation matters.
Mick Norris
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Re: Ecf AGM 2022

Post by Mick Norris » Sat Aug 13, 2022 5:41 pm

Indeed Roger, the more we concentrate everything down south the better do you think?
Any postings on here represent my personal views

LawrenceCooper
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Re: Ecf AGM 2022

Post by LawrenceCooper » Sat Aug 13, 2022 5:58 pm

Mick Norris wrote:
Sat Aug 13, 2022 5:41 pm
Indeed Roger, the more we concentrate everything down south the better do you think?
Ironically, someone who lives in London recently said that there is no classical rated chess for them unlike the rest of the country :wink:

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Chris Goodall
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Re: Ecf AGM 2022

Post by Chris Goodall » Sat Aug 13, 2022 7:49 pm

Roger Lancaster wrote:
Sat Aug 13, 2022 3:08 pm
There's an argument which says that choice of venue shouldn't be determined solely by geography but should also reflect where players actually live. Judging by 4NCL experience, numbers are maximised if events are held south of Birmingham but north of Milton Keynes.
The classic problem of whether to minimise the maximum travel time or the average. England's centre of population is supposed to be at the Daventry freight terminal by the M1, so the range of optimal solutions should be between Birmingham and there. As a rail passenger, my second choice would be Coventry and third choice Rugby.
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Mick Norris
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Re: Ecf AGM 2022

Post by Mick Norris » Sat Aug 13, 2022 8:44 pm

LawrenceCooper wrote:
Sat Aug 13, 2022 5:58 pm
Mick Norris wrote:
Sat Aug 13, 2022 5:41 pm
Indeed Roger, the more we concentrate everything down south the better do you think?
Ironically, someone who lives in London recently said that there is no classical rated chess for them unlike the rest of the country :wink:
That's no good is it? It's almost like you could run an event and call it, I dunno, the London Chess Classic
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John Reyes
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Re: ECF AGM 2022

Post by John Reyes » Wed Aug 31, 2022 11:17 am

I have been having a chat with a few people and My motion was going to be this

That from the 2023 meetings going forward to add a northern city that has great public transport for hybrid meeting for AGM/Financial meetings.

(the reason is for cost, but also with public transport to the north, it would be cheaper to host it up here)
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Kevin Thurlow
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Re: ECF AGM 2022

Post by Kevin Thurlow » Wed Aug 31, 2022 11:36 am

"That from the 2023 meetings going forward to add a northern city that has great public transport for hybrid meeting for AGM/Financial meetings."

This is an argument that has been going on since 1904 (maybe earlier). BCF did experiment with different venues 20 or so years ago, as someone in the NW was screaming about going to London or Birmingham all the time. So BCF helpfully put meetings in East Anglia and Derby, and there was a very reduced attendance, as it was even more difficult to get there... Then NW person was screaming at the nextmeeting that that was worse!

So either move the meetings round the country, Truro, Hartlepool, Southend, Cheltenham etc., or go for the places with good transport links, like London, Birmingham, Manchester (you can even rent a meeting room at Manchester Aiprport, and there's a quick rail link to the city too), Leeds etc.

You will still get people complaining though.We even had someone complaining that the venue was difficult to get to, when he lived in the same county.

John Reyes
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Re: ECF AGM 2022

Post by John Reyes » Wed Aug 31, 2022 3:22 pm

Kevin Thurlow wrote:
Wed Aug 31, 2022 11:36 am
"That from the 2023 meetings going forward to add a northern city that has great public transport for hybrid meeting for AGM/Financial meetings."

This is an argument that has been going on since 1904 (maybe earlier). BCF did experiment with different venues 20 or so years ago, as someone in the NW was screaming about going to London or Birmingham all the time. So BCF helpfully put meetings in East Anglia and Derby, and there was a very reduced attendance, as it was even more difficult to get there... Then NW person was screaming at the nextmeeting that that was worse!

So either move the meetings round the country, Truro, Hartlepool, Southend, Cheltenham etc., or go for the places with good transport links, like London, Birmingham, Manchester (you can even rent a meeting room at Manchester Aiprport, and there's a quick rail link to the city too), Leeds etc.

You will still get people complaining though.We even had someone complaining that the venue was difficult to get to, when he lived in the same county.
I found a few venue that was good for the ECF and i don't know the budget but in the city centre etc

the Wording was this

the Next ECF AGM is held in the North of England, (either in leeds or Manchester) with Accessible train and Road Links, to be put on the ECF rota of meeting with Birmingham and london.

you are right about moving the meetings around the country, but in theory, the meeting might be in places where some people will have trouble getting to. ie manchester to truro on train would take me over 7 hrs and cost me £198. but manchester to london will cost me around £95 plus bus/taxi fare to the venue.
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NickFaulks
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Re: ECF AGM 2022

Post by NickFaulks » Wed Aug 31, 2022 3:47 pm

John Reyes wrote:
Wed Aug 31, 2022 3:22 pm
manchester to london will cost me around £95 plus bus/taxi fare to the venue.
I strongly recommend the bus.
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Kevin Thurlow
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Re: ECF AGM 2022

Post by Kevin Thurlow » Wed Aug 31, 2022 5:52 pm

Of course people in Truro have a rotten journey every time!

But I think your wording is reasonable.

Paul Cooksey
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Re: ECF AGM 2022

Post by Paul Cooksey » Wed Aug 31, 2022 6:12 pm

Kevin Thurlow wrote:
Wed Aug 31, 2022 11:36 am
This is an argument that has been going on since 1904 (maybe earlier)
I am sure this is true, but the possibility of hybrid meetings does change things.

We have seen the importance of the ECF Council diminish over the last decade. Maybe it is fading away.

Ian Thompson
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Re: ECF AGM 2022

Post by Ian Thompson » Wed Aug 31, 2022 6:46 pm

John Reyes wrote:
Wed Aug 31, 2022 11:17 am
I have been having a chat with a few people and My motion was going to be this

That from the 2023 meetings going forward to add a northern city that has great public transport for hybrid meeting for AGM/Financial meetings.

(the reason is for cost, but also with public transport to the north, it would be cheaper to host it up here)
If the primary criterion is the most good long distance public transport links then as close as you can get to Birmingham New Street station would be the best place according to Network Rail.

John Reyes
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Re: ECF AGM 2022

Post by John Reyes » Wed Aug 31, 2022 7:26 pm

Ian Thompson wrote:
Wed Aug 31, 2022 6:46 pm
[quote="John Reyes" post_id=287316 time=<a href="tel:1661941050">1661941050</a> user_id=5893]
I have been having a chat with a few people and My motion was going to be this

That from the 2023 meetings going forward to add a northern city that has great public transport for hybrid meeting for AGM/Financial meetings.

(the reason is for cost, but also with public transport to the north, it would be cheaper to host it up here)
If the primary criterion is the most good long distance public transport links then as close as you can get to Birmingham New Street station would be the best place according to Network Rail.
[/quote]

I just never understand why we travel to Birmingham or London! But I do feel that you have to move with the times as the last two meeting in London, has been a bit of a distance from king cross and Euston.
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Chris Goodall
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Re: ECF AGM 2022

Post by Chris Goodall » Wed Aug 31, 2022 8:46 pm

The way to accommodate both Newcastle and Truro is Birmingham. Network Rail is correct.

There is also the Roger Lancaster school of thought - the greatest good to the greatest number. Which realistically would dictate London.

There is no advantage to anywhere north of Birmingham, other than variety. A line drawn halfway down England would divide its population in a 6:1 ratio, and the south-east has more graded chess players per head than anywhere else.
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Roger Lancaster
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Re: ECF AGM 2022

Post by Roger Lancaster » Thu Sep 01, 2022 11:03 am

I actually said "Judging by 4NCL experience, numbers are maximised if events are held south of Birmingham but north of Milton Keynes" rather than London. I realise that Mick thinks this is "down south" but that's not necessarily the perception of someone living in Brighton or Bournemouth.

Paul Cooksey
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Re: ECF AGM 2022

Post by Paul Cooksey » Thu Sep 01, 2022 11:33 am

My Mancunian father considers Stockport down south.

But I wasn't joking above, that I think the discussion is at least as much about hybrid meetings as opposed to location. At the last Finance Council the majority of delegates from the South East joined via Zoom rather than going into London.

If you take the view a primary purpose of Council is for organisers from different areas to network, this is problematic. Arguably the EJCOA replacing a historic ECF function here