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Re: Observing the ECF AGM

Posted: Sat Oct 16, 2021 7:38 am
by Tim Spanton
To be fair, reporting of Parliament used to be banned too.

From the official UK Parliament account:
In 1738 the Commons [declared] that it was a "high indignity and a notorious breach of privilege" to report what was said in the Chamber.
Preventing publication of unofficial parliamentary reports finally ended in 1771 following a legal battle by the radical MP and journalist John Wilkes against attempts to arrest several printers.
By the late 18th century parliamentary reporting flourished, even though reporters were supposed to reconstruct debates from memory and not take notes. A ban on taking notes was lifted in the Commons in 1783 and later in the Lords.

So the ECF is not all that far behind.

Re: Observing the ECF AGM

Posted: Sat Oct 16, 2021 9:01 am
by Kevin Thurlow
Shareholders of companies can turn up and vote at AGMs, to no effect of course as their solitary votes are outweighed by the management's thousands. (I recall being at a BCF meeting, where a show of hands indicated the vote was going one way, and the chairman said that as SCCU, NCCU, EACU and MCCU had voted the other way that a card vote was pointless, and he was right...)

So ECF can reasonably say that only those with votes can attend. I suppose now instead of the unions, it's those with a financial interest who are controlling the vote.

Re: Observing the ECF AGM

Posted: Sat Oct 16, 2021 9:27 am
by J T Melsom
On reflection its obvious that the enabling ECF is failing to market the AGM properly and should be more imaginative. Why not hire a larger venue, and have supporting events for members who want to attend but might want to take a break when the excitement gets a bit too much. I'm sure it would be possible to arrange a book stall, social games and a match against the ECF board at the close of business. And the live reporting could clearly be livened up as well. Real-time interviews with dejected losers in the elections anyone. Okay maybe not the last one...

Re: Observing the ECF AGM

Posted: Sat Oct 16, 2021 9:43 am
by NickFaulks
Fringe meetings are a must.

Re: Observing the ECF AGM

Posted: Sat Oct 16, 2021 9:50 am
by Bob Kane
I agree , JTM but why not broaden the appeal even further , invite the public ,the curious queens gambit fans, the new social members.
The ECF should have its own stall, providing information for all aspiring chess players, members or not.
Book stall, free simul , meet your representative,

Re: Observing the ECF AGM

Posted: Sat Oct 16, 2021 9:53 am
by J T Melsom
Master classes in bullying and other life skills?

Re: Observing the ECF AGM

Posted: Sun Oct 17, 2021 1:11 pm
by Chris Goodall
Nick Grey wrote:
Fri Oct 15, 2021 10:46 pm
Berkshire Chess Association who is the rep?
Paul Cooksey. Who has no "ticket" other than being Berkshire rep, so John would have displaced Paul from the meeting had he attended.

That you need to nominate your voting rep in writing and have it published in the voting register, makes sense. What if two people both claim to represent the same organisation and then disagree about how to vote for? And non-voting observers shouldn't be allowed in the meeting, because then the chair has to keep track of whose hands to ignore if there's a show of hands.

Re: Observing the ECF AGM

Posted: Sun Oct 17, 2021 1:35 pm
by Michael Farthing
Chris,
The application was for an observer, not a change of representative.
There are technical problems posed for the chairman with observers but they are not great if the number is small (which was the case) and we have the technology to solve them completely.
The issue here was specifically that it was a press request and that is not the custom of Council to invite press. The custom of Council should be changed by Council and not arbitrarily changed by the Chairman, however beneficial he might perceive that change to be. That was the issue and the upshot is that it is top of the agenda for the next meeting where it can be discussed fully.

Re: Observing the ECF AGM

Posted: Sun Oct 17, 2021 1:48 pm
by Chris Goodall
Michael Farthing wrote:
Sun Oct 17, 2021 1:35 pm
Chris,
The application was for an observer, not a change of representative.
And I agree with your decision not to make an exception for one particular observer. If you had, I would have applied to be an observer too! I was just addressing the point that someone without a ticket might be able to get in by discovering a county affiliation.

Re: Observing the ECF AGM

Posted: Sun Oct 17, 2021 4:46 pm
by Roger de Coverly
Chris Goodall wrote:
Sun Oct 17, 2021 1:48 pm
I was just addressing the point that someone without a ticket might be able to get in by discovering a county affiliation.
I had assumed that the way to gain legitimate access was to ask for the loan of one of the representations or proxies from one of the several attendees with spares.

Re: Observing the ECF AGM

Posted: Sun Oct 17, 2021 4:56 pm
by Paul Cooksey
Alex Holowczak said he thought this was a two part question when Michael raised it. I agree there is an important distinction between observing the meeting and participating in it.

Lots of ways John could have become a participant, but observing was more difficult. There were a few dissenting opinions on allowing broadcast of the meeting, but had overwhelming support in a straw poll.

I suspect youtube or similar and keeping zoom for participants will be agreed. Slightly less clear to me if it should be live.

I see arguments for board confidentiality, but think Council should be as open as possible. To be honest I don't consider anything I say about Council a leak. I think is part of my job to tell people what happened.

Re: Observing the ECF AGM

Posted: Mon Oct 18, 2021 10:15 pm
by Hok Yin Stephen Chiu
Adam Raoof wrote:
Fri Oct 15, 2021 9:33 pm
If someone were given one proxy vote, are they eligible to attend?

If a member of the ECF wants to attend, is there anything objectionable in this? Are they not entitled to attend even if they cannot vote?
It strikes me that both Michael and Adam are right. There is no precedence for press observers. But, logically, any paying member ought to have the right to observe silently, over zoom.

(Admittedly, I had some problems with zoom from my side, and dropped out part way through, at the last meeting, missing various bits, but the point stands!)