Latest ECF Covid-19 Guidance

Debate directly related to English Chess Federation matters.

Latest ECF Covid-19 Guidance.

Poll ended at Mon May 31, 2021 10:54 am

I would be willing to be a player or an arbiter at an event conducted on the basis of these arrangements
16
44%
I would be not willing to be a player or an arbiter at an event conducted on the basis of these arrangements.
15
42%
Other (please post in the thread).
4
11%
Don't know.
1
3%
 
Total votes: 36

David Sedgwick
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Latest ECF Covid-19 Guidance

Post by David Sedgwick » Sat May 01, 2021 10:54 am

Please see https://www.englishchess.org.uk/latest- ... formation/ for the latest guidance from the ECF.

This guidance relates to the period after 21st June, the date on which all restrictions are scheduled to be officially lifted.

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Adam Raoof
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Re: Latest ECF Covid-19 Guidance

Post by Adam Raoof » Sat May 01, 2021 11:03 am

Thanks David, I have no doubt we will be able to run tournaments normally for at least July and August, so I have booked my venue for four dates accordingly!
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David Sedgwick
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Re: Latest ECF Covid-19 Guidance

Post by David Sedgwick » Sat May 01, 2021 11:11 am

Adam Raoof wrote:
Sat May 01, 2021 11:03 am
Thanks David, I have no doubt we will be able to run tournaments normally for at least July and August, so I have booked my venue for four dates accordingly!
How much notice, if any, will you be taking of this ECF guidance?

Colin Purdon
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Re: Latest ECF Covid-19 Guidance

Post by Colin Purdon » Sat May 01, 2021 11:30 am

I voted "I would be willing" but I was tempted to go for "Other".

The guidance has many recommendations for the organiser to "Consider", and I may well make my mind up depending on how many of the guidelines are actually implemented for the event in question.

Joseph Conlon
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Re: Latest ECF Covid-19 Guidance

Post by Joseph Conlon » Sat May 01, 2021 1:14 pm

Colin Purdon wrote:
Sat May 01, 2021 11:30 am
I voted "I would be willing" but I was tempted to go for "Other".

The guidance has many recommendations for the organiser to "Consider", and I may well make my mind up depending on how many of the guidelines are actually implemented for the event in question.
I second this as the way to read the document. It has lots of things to consider but few things that are required. As I have said elsewhere, people range in their levels of Covid caution, and organisers can choose to pitch events at different levels. Events for over 65s are very different to events for under 8s. In my junior events currently, there are lots of these points that I have "considered" but have not implemented (sometimes for very mundane reasons - I originally planned larger tables, and then discovered younger juniors couldn't reach the pieces).

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Matt Mackenzie
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Re: Latest ECF Covid-19 Guidance

Post by Matt Mackenzie » Sat May 01, 2021 4:07 pm

People conflating *guidance* with things that are *mandatory* has been a problem throughout this pandemic.
"Set up your attacks so that when the fire is out, it isn't out!" (H N Pillsbury)

NickFaulks
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Re: Latest ECF Covid-19 Guidance

Post by NickFaulks » Sat May 01, 2021 4:51 pm

Matt Mackenzie wrote:
Sat May 01, 2021 4:07 pm
People conflating *guidance* with things that are *mandatory* has been a problem throughout this pandemic.
You mean, like the police.
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Adam Raoof
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Re: Latest ECF Covid-19 Guidance

Post by Adam Raoof » Sat May 01, 2021 5:24 pm

David Sedgwick wrote:
Sat May 01, 2021 11:11 am
Adam Raoof wrote:
Sat May 01, 2021 11:03 am
Thanks David, I have no doubt we will be able to run tournaments normally for at least July and August, so I have booked my venue for four dates accordingly!
How much notice, if any, will you be taking of this ECF guidance?
I will be honest and say I have no idea who they consulted before producing this document. There is some good advice, and I have produced my own "regulations" based on common sense and where I expect us to all be in July and August (link below). However somewhere further down the page I think it strayed into difficult territory. Would I be an arbiter or a player under some or all of these guidelines? Yes, probably, but it depends on which guidelines. I do understand that some players will simply not wear a mask, and some won't have a vaccination. I can exert some control over the former and I don't feel it's my business to ask about the latter. It's the people who won't do either that I don't really want to meet...

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1lvX ... sp=sharing
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Roger Lancaster
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Re: Latest ECF Covid-19 Guidance

Post by Roger Lancaster » Sat May 01, 2021 6:14 pm

Joseph Conlon wrote:
Sat May 01, 2021 1:14 pm
Colin Purdon wrote:
Sat May 01, 2021 11:30 am
I voted "I would be willing" but I was tempted to go for "Other".

The guidance has many recommendations for the organiser to "Consider", and I may well make my mind up depending on how many of the guidelines are actually implemented for the event in question.
I second this as the way to read the document. It has lots of things to consider but few things that are required. As I have said elsewhere, people range in their levels of Covid caution, and organisers can choose to pitch events at different levels. Events for over 65s are very different to events for under 8s. In my junior events currently, there are lots of these points that I have "considered" but have not implemented (sometimes for very mundane reasons - I originally planned larger tables, and then discovered younger juniors couldn't reach the pieces).
I agree with this. In organising any event, whether chess-related or not, the organisers are expected to undertake a sensible risk assessment which these days includes Covid-related risks as well as long-established checks such as establishing whether there is a separate fire exit. That risk assessment should eliminate any practices that are unlawful. Where there are HMG guidelines only, I'd suggest any risk assessment is well-advised to comply with these unless it can demonstrate clear reasons why some of those guidelines can be safely disregarded - for example, it's juniors-only or it's a purely local event in a part of the country which is showing no, or a negligible number of, Covid infections.

In that context, "can be safely disregarded" means negligible risk rather than none - there are always risks in life and it's not possible to organise events with literally zero risk. Establishing there's a separate exit doesn't totally eliminate the fire risk - there's always the [remote] chance of an arsonist setting two fires alight.

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Matt Mackenzie
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Re: Latest ECF Covid-19 Guidance

Post by Matt Mackenzie » Sat May 01, 2021 6:17 pm

NickFaulks wrote:
Sat May 01, 2021 4:51 pm
Matt Mackenzie wrote:
Sat May 01, 2021 4:07 pm
People conflating *guidance* with things that are *mandatory* has been a problem throughout this pandemic.
You mean, like the police.
They have certainly done this, yes. Along with many others.
"Set up your attacks so that when the fire is out, it isn't out!" (H N Pillsbury)

Angus French
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Re: Latest ECF Covid-19 Guidance

Post by Angus French » Sat May 01, 2021 6:28 pm

Oxford Primary Healthcare has produced a series of short and informative videos about aerosol transmission of the virus and making indoor spaces safe: https://www.phc.ox.ac.uk/research/resou ... aces-space

Paul Buswell
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Re: Latest ECF Covid-19 Guidance

Post by Paul Buswell » Sat May 01, 2021 6:44 pm

It will depend entirely on which of the 'considerations' the organiser implemented. If too many - let alone all - I think I will fall into the 'not willing' category. But because of the vagueness I have voted 'Other'

PB

Kevin Thurlow
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Re: Latest ECF Covid-19 Guidance

Post by Kevin Thurlow » Sat May 01, 2021 7:34 pm

"In that context, "can be safely disregarded" means negligible risk rather than none - there are always risks in life and it's not possible to organise events with literally zero risk. Establishing there's a separate exit doesn't totally eliminate the fire risk - there's always the [remote] chance of an arsonist setting two fires alight."

Yes. In chemical safety, we deal with "hazard", not "risk". Using petrol, or concentrated acids, or even crossing the road can be dangerous, but you can reduce the risk, by taking sensible precautions. Otherwise, you cannot really do anything!

Ken Norman
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Re: Latest ECF Covid-19 Guidance

Post by Ken Norman » Sun May 02, 2021 1:14 pm

Until the Covid 19 pandemic is over worldwide. The organiser of any OTB Chess event involving Seniors needs to ensure the safety of these Senior players. The obvious precaution is only to accept entries from people who have been vaccinated. Arbiters and other organisers should also have been vaccinated.

J T Melsom
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Re: Latest ECF Covid-19 Guidance

Post by J T Melsom » Sun May 02, 2021 3:13 pm

There is an obvious problem with insisting on vaccination of organisers. Not that some will refuse, but that some of our best are not yet eligible.

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