Cheating in chess

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Roger de Coverly
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Re: Cheating in chess

Post by Roger de Coverly » Sun Dec 12, 2021 2:08 pm

Matt Bridgeman wrote:
Sun Dec 12, 2021 11:50 am
The slight clue for the loss of popularity being in yet another Lichess account ‘violation’ mid event.
It may cut both ways. A reluctance to enter for fear of being paired against engine assistance and a fear of being dumped out of the tournament for no atated reason.

Matt Bridgeman
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Re: Cheating in chess

Post by Matt Bridgeman » Wed Dec 15, 2021 4:26 pm

Roger de Coverly wrote:
Sun Dec 12, 2021 2:08 pm
Matt Bridgeman wrote:
Sun Dec 12, 2021 11:50 am
The slight clue for the loss of popularity being in yet another Lichess account ‘violation’ mid event.
It may cut both ways. A reluctance to enter for fear of being paired against engine assistance and a fear of being dumped out of the tournament for no atated reason.
I'm sure you're right. Maybe 95% one part and 5% the other. I guess toon will tell if the online 4NCL congress entries pick up a bit now with all the inevitable over the board cancellations.

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Joey Stewart
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Re: Cheating in chess

Post by Joey Stewart » Wed Dec 15, 2021 5:16 pm

Lichess are incredibly lax when punishing engine users (i report loads and barely ever see any action taken) so it must be other reasons that people are getting ejected from tournaments like, for example, if you open a second lichess window while playing it will instantly forfeit the game you are playing (even just checking your inbox will do this). I have heard reports of people instantly forfeiting games for "accidentally" clicking the analysis button during games but have somewhat less sympathy for those cases.
Lose one queen and it is a disaster, Lose 1000 queens and it is just a statistic.

LawrenceCooper
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Re: Cheating in chess

Post by LawrenceCooper » Wed Dec 15, 2021 5:23 pm

Joey Stewart wrote:
Wed Dec 15, 2021 5:16 pm
Lichess are incredibly lax when punishing engine users (i report loads and barely ever see any action taken) so it must be other reasons that people are getting ejected from tournaments like, for example, if you open a second lichess window while playing it will instantly forfeit the game you are playing (even just checking your inbox will do this). I have heard reports of people instantly forfeiting games for "accidentally" clicking the analysis button during games but have somewhat less sympathy for those cases.
They are also rather trigger happy in their messages warning against sandbagging when players have disconnection problems :oops:

Joseph Conlon
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Re: Cheating in chess

Post by Joseph Conlon » Wed Dec 15, 2021 8:26 pm

Joey Stewart wrote:
Wed Dec 15, 2021 5:16 pm
Lichess are incredibly lax when punishing engine users (i report loads and barely ever see any action taken) so it must be other reasons that people are getting ejected from tournaments like, for example, if you open a second lichess window while playing it will instantly forfeit the game you are playing (even just checking your inbox will do this). I have heard reports of people instantly forfeiting games for "accidentally" clicking the analysis button during games but have somewhat less sympathy for those cases.
My experience is different; I have reported a lot less than 'loads' (around 10-20 in total I think out of several thousand games) and almost every time I have reported someone they have subsequently been banned.

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IM Jack Rudd
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Re: Cheating in chess

Post by IM Jack Rudd » Wed Dec 15, 2021 9:07 pm

My experience is similar to Joseph's; I have in fact had more opponents banned for cheating than I have reported for doing so.

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Joey Stewart
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Re: Cheating in chess

Post by Joey Stewart » Thu Dec 16, 2021 12:12 am

I guess if you only report the absolute dead certain cheaters there will seem to be less of them, but in my experience the ones who recite the entire game slowly and methodically via an engine are becoming rarer and a lot more cheats these days are centaurs who know enough about the game to win sloppily and keep their match with software a lot lower once they have cheated their way to an overwhelming position. I don't let such players fool me, - the pattern is obvious and they get an instant report and block the moment the game is over!
Lose one queen and it is a disaster, Lose 1000 queens and it is just a statistic.

Stewart Reuben
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Re: Cheating in chess

Post by Stewart Reuben » Thu Dec 16, 2021 12:30 am

There must also be players who claim their opponent has cheated because they were dissatisfied with the result of the game.

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Joey Stewart
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Re: Cheating in chess

Post by Joey Stewart » Thu Dec 16, 2021 1:44 am

I'm sure there are, though it seems like a very passive aggressive thing to be doing, usually such players prefer to take advantage of the anonymity of the internet to unleash a barrage of insults at their opponent.
Lose one queen and it is a disaster, Lose 1000 queens and it is just a statistic.

Phil Neatherway
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Re: Cheating in chess

Post by Phil Neatherway » Thu Dec 16, 2021 3:22 pm

Joey,
how can you tell if someone on lichess is using a computer?

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Joey Stewart
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Re: Cheating in chess

Post by Joey Stewart » Thu Dec 16, 2021 8:12 pm

Phil Neatherway wrote:
Thu Dec 16, 2021 3:22 pm
Joey,
how can you tell if someone on lichess is using a computer?
They win with absolute ease and I never get a single chance the whole game - I've played against grand masters and got further then that so there no way a random 2200 scrub on the internet is secretly the greatest player in history, they are definitely cheats.

They get into awful positions early on and suddenly their play becomes incredibly accurate with brilliant tactics - again, unless they are titled in some way I am not giving them the benefit of the doubt and sending the game in as evidence they turned their engine on mid game.

Even if players like this are not using engine are simply underrated that in still in itself a form of cheating and deserves punishment so either way I have the moral high ground and irrefutable evidence of cheating!
Lose one queen and it is a disaster, Lose 1000 queens and it is just a statistic.

LawrenceCooper
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Re: Cheating in chess

Post by LawrenceCooper » Thu Dec 16, 2021 8:17 pm

Joey Stewart wrote:
Thu Dec 16, 2021 8:12 pm
Even if players like this are not using engine are simply underrated that in still in itself a form of cheating and deserves punishment so either way I have the moral high ground and irrefutable evidence of cheating!
A little harsh :lol:

Phil Neatherway
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Re: Cheating in chess

Post by Phil Neatherway » Thu Dec 16, 2021 8:34 pm

Not sure I agree with the use of the word 'irrefutable'.

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Joey Stewart
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Re: Cheating in chess

Post by Joey Stewart » Thu Dec 16, 2021 8:49 pm

Phil Neatherway wrote:
Thu Dec 16, 2021 8:34 pm
Not sure I agree with the use of the word 'irrefutable'.
If you were the one being cheated I dare say you too would want swift and terrible vergence meted out on your opponent.
Lose one queen and it is a disaster, Lose 1000 queens and it is just a statistic.

Phil Neatherway
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Re: Cheating in chess

Post by Phil Neatherway » Thu Dec 16, 2021 8:56 pm

only if I had irrefutable evidence.

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