NCCU and the MCF
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Re: NCCU and the MCF
That brings up another excellent point, people abstaining from votes - I really don't like the idea of making the effort to join an organisation then ducking out in such a cowardly fashion and leaving the remaining voting power in the hands of an even smaller minority then it already was. I think it would be much better if in all meetings you aren't voting yes then you should automatically be lumped into the "no" camp, there are things in life where a third outcome is simply not going to happen and you need to pick a side !
Lose one queen and it is a disaster, Lose 1000 queens and it is just a statistic.
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Re: NCCU and the MCF
You don't actually get higher-quality decisions by forcing people to pick a side, and interpreting failures to vote as votes for a particular side will horribly skew your decisions.
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Re: NCCU and the MCF
Be that as it may, it is an indisputable fact that abstainers indirectly support the winning outcome of any vote they could have had a hand in by removing themselves from the process so I figure since they are still influencing the final result regardless it is better to get them involved.
Lose one queen and it is a disaster, Lose 1000 queens and it is just a statistic.
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Re: NCCU and the MCF
I consider it my right as a semi-Yorkshireman to employ all legal methods of abstaining from a vote. Including hiding in a closet (or disconnecting from the wifi), finding a fellow abstainer to vote the opposite way, raising my left hand for one option and my right hand for the other, or taking out a 50p coin and flipping it and asking if the parties involved really, truly want to know the outcome. As a last resort, if my vote is actually going to be decisive, announce in advance that I'm going to apply Speaker Dennison's Rule: vote to create a tie, thus necessitating more debate until someone changes their mind, or vote to break a tie in favour of the status quo.IM Jack Rudd wrote: ↑Sat Jun 18, 2022 12:04 amYou don't actually get higher-quality decisions by forcing people to pick a side, and interpreting failures to vote as votes for a particular side will horribly skew your decisions.
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Re: NCCU and the MCF
Is this the "modern maths" they teach in schools nowadays?Joey Stewart wrote: ↑Sat Jun 18, 2022 1:14 amBe that as it may, it is an indisputable fact that abstainers indirectly support the winning outcome of any vote they could have had a hand in by removing themselves from the process
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Re: NCCU and the MCF
Has anybody on this forum been a school pupil recently?
"Do you play chess?"
"Yes, but I prefer a game with a better chance of cheating."
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"Yes, but I prefer a game with a better chance of cheating."
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Re: NCCU and the MCF
Is a semi-Yorkshireman someone who, when asked whether they're from Yorkshire, abstains?Chris Goodall wrote: ↑Sat Jun 18, 2022 1:39 amI consider it my right as a semi-Yorkshireman to employ all legal methods of abstaining from a vote. Including hiding in a closet (or disconnecting from the wifi), finding a fellow abstainer to vote the opposite way, raising my left hand for one option and my right hand for the other, or taking out a 50p coin and flipping it and asking if the parties involved really, truly want to know the outcome. As a last resort, if my vote is actually going to be decisive, announce in advance that I'm going to apply Speaker Dennison's Rule: vote to create a tie, thus necessitating more debate until someone changes their mind, or vote to break a tie in favour of the status quo.
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Re: NCCU and the MCF
I'm not sure what this "semi Yorkshireman" blather is about but when the MCF applied for membership of the NCCU in 2014 the Yorkshire delegates were instructed to vote in favour and duly did.
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Chairman - Harrogate Chess Club
All views expressed entirely my own
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Re: NCCU and the MCF
At the YCA AGM today Yorkshire voted on our position in the event that the MCF were to apply to the NCCU for membership.
In my newly appointed role as President of the YCA I am pleased to confirm that the YCA voted firmly in favour of supporting any such application and would welcome Manchester back into the NCCU.
Our NCCU delegates (Steve Westmoreland and Rupert Jones) will support any such application if a new vote is subsequently held.
In my newly appointed role as President of the YCA I am pleased to confirm that the YCA voted firmly in favour of supporting any such application and would welcome Manchester back into the NCCU.
Our NCCU delegates (Steve Westmoreland and Rupert Jones) will support any such application if a new vote is subsequently held.
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Re: NCCU and the MCF
That's very kind, and good news, but there's nothing to add to our application of 8 years ago
We were asked to meet with Lancs, we did, it was pointless as they had no interest in anything we had to say, nor did they try and refute anything in our application, let alone explain why we should redraw our county boundaries
So, unless the other counties wish to consider the merits of our application, there is nothing we can do in my view
We were asked to meet with Lancs, we did, it was pointless as they had no interest in anything we had to say, nor did they try and refute anything in our application, let alone explain why we should redraw our county boundaries
So, unless the other counties wish to consider the merits of our application, there is nothing we can do in my view
Any postings on here represent my personal views
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Re: NCCU and the MCF
Hi Stephen, I think you would need to speak with counties other than Lancs about what they think
They might want to have another look at the application we made as we hope it answers most questions they might have
They might want to have another look at the application we made as we hope it answers most questions they might have
Any postings on here represent my personal views
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Re: NCCU and the MCF
'back' into the NCCU? Has Manchester ever been in it?Andrew Wainwright wrote: ↑Sat Jun 18, 2022 9:46 pmthe YCA voted firmly in favour of supporting any such application and would welcome Manchester back into the NCCU.
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Re: NCCU and the MCF
As the Yorkshire captain at the Greater Manchester-Yorkshire match I noted that Greater Manchester played a player aged under 10 and although he didn't win he did show great promise and looks to be a strong player for the future.
But of course juniors like him cannot currently play for the team they wish to represent in the future, at least in the NCCU where their team is based, because of a umpteen year old situation predating their birth which has resulted in the team not being to enter through the NCCU despite the fact that this is where Greater Manchester is.
I'm sure these juniors care a lot about this, which is so complex it requires a 22 page thread, and fully appreciate why despite the ECF recognising Greater Manchester the NCCU does not.
Can I take this opportunity to request that, should Greater Manchester apply to the NCCU again, people consider these junior players who will be coming through the chess ranks in the future, and consider - really consider - whether prolonging this situation any further into the 21st century is best for chess and the people who play chess - present and future (I have deliberately omitted "past") - before saying "no" or abstaining.
At a time where county chess is struggling surely as the incumbent generation our legacy to the game and to the generations that follow is to act in such a way that we allow as many people as possible to play as much as they want, when they want and for whom they want. Prolonging a position which has resulted in a team from being able to play in their rightful geographical union should not be a legacy anyone should want to aspire to.
But of course juniors like him cannot currently play for the team they wish to represent in the future, at least in the NCCU where their team is based, because of a umpteen year old situation predating their birth which has resulted in the team not being to enter through the NCCU despite the fact that this is where Greater Manchester is.
I'm sure these juniors care a lot about this, which is so complex it requires a 22 page thread, and fully appreciate why despite the ECF recognising Greater Manchester the NCCU does not.
Can I take this opportunity to request that, should Greater Manchester apply to the NCCU again, people consider these junior players who will be coming through the chess ranks in the future, and consider - really consider - whether prolonging this situation any further into the 21st century is best for chess and the people who play chess - present and future (I have deliberately omitted "past") - before saying "no" or abstaining.
At a time where county chess is struggling surely as the incumbent generation our legacy to the game and to the generations that follow is to act in such a way that we allow as many people as possible to play as much as they want, when they want and for whom they want. Prolonging a position which has resulted in a team from being able to play in their rightful geographical union should not be a legacy anyone should want to aspire to.