Use of an electronic device whilst game in progress

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John Upham
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Use of an electronic device whilst game in progress

Post by John Upham » Sun Aug 14, 2022 2:10 pm

An interesting scenario arose in a recent evening match played in a English evening league.

(names have been withheld to protect the parties involved)

An away player had forgotten to bring a conventional means (a scoresheet and pen/pencil) of recording his /her moves.
The away player did not obtain such materials from the home club despite being in plentiful supply (I know this since I have played there many times). The reason for this is unknown.

The game commenced and without consulting the home player the away player proceeded to openly use his / her mobile telephonic device as a means of entering the results in front of the home player.

The home player queried this but the away player continued, claiming that he / she did not hear the home player speaking to him / her.

A second query occurred and then the home captain (an ECF arbiter) was consulted and advised discontinuation of the mobile telephone use and the continuation with the use of scoresheet and pen.

A lack of agreement followed and both players became somewhat upset and the game was halted after 10 moves by each player.

A subsequent appeal to the league committee caused the game to be scored 0-0 which went down very badly indeed with the home team.

The away player is a regular 4NCL player (as is the home player).

How would you as home captain / home player have handled this scenario?
Last edited by John Upham on Sun Aug 14, 2022 5:12 pm, edited 4 times in total.
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MartinCarpenter
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Re: Use of an electronic device whilst game in progress

Post by MartinCarpenter » Sun Aug 14, 2022 2:32 pm

Given them a scoresheet and pen, you'd hope? Surprised if none of their teammates had a spare pen at least, chess players often carry plentiful supplies....

If - obviously unknown - the home club actively refused to do that then 0-0 seems a bit generous to both sides :)

Kevin Thurlow
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Re: Use of an electronic device whilst game in progress

Post by Kevin Thurlow » Sun Aug 14, 2022 3:02 pm

I would have thought that the home side supplies a room, tables, chairs, sets, boards, clocks and score-sheets as a bare minimum. There may be optional extras. Unless the away player is physically unable to record the game, why are they using a recording device?

One of my team-mates a few years ago had diabetes so badly, (it's no fun at any level of course) that he had been fitted with an insulin pump. So he had to explain to every opponent, that it might go "beep" during the game (and he could hardly turn it off...). Happily, all of them immediately accepted that they wouldn't complain if it made a noise.

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John Upham
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Re: Use of an electronic device whilst game in progress

Post by John Upham » Sun Aug 14, 2022 3:03 pm

MartinCarpenter wrote:
Sun Aug 14, 2022 2:32 pm
Given them a scoresheet and pen, you'd hope? Surprised if none of their teammates had a spare pen at least, chess players often carry plentiful supplies....

If - obviously unknown - the home club actively refused to do that then 0-0 seems a bit generous to both sides :)
Scoresheets and pens were freely available at the home venue.

The away player insisted on continuing to score with his mobile telephone at which point (more or less) the home player refused to continue and the game halted uncompleted.
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J T Melsom
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Re: Use of an electronic device whilst game in progress

Post by J T Melsom » Sun Aug 14, 2022 3:13 pm

At my club I would have expected the visiting side to be supportive of their team mate in providing a pen but the home side to provide the scoresheet as part of the match equipment. I've never heard of a match where visitors supply scoresheets. A home or away player without a pen would have recourse to the club supply and this has happened in the past.

I have had a laptop open away from the match boards to record the result in real-time, but not when participating in the match. I don't understand why either club captain thought a mobile used at the board was acceptable, and the matter should have been resolved at the outset of the match. A double default does seem harsh as one side probably offended more than the other but equally both sides don't exactly invite sympathy.

Roger Lancaster
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Re: Use of an electronic device whilst game in progress

Post by Roger Lancaster » Sun Aug 14, 2022 3:23 pm

I think I'd first like to know the reason why, if a scoresheet and pen was in "plentiful supply" and "freely available", the away player "was not able to obtain such materials from the home club". (Otherwise, I agree with JTM above).

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Re: Use of an electronic device whilst game in progress

Post by Ian Thompson » Sun Aug 14, 2022 3:37 pm

As the league rules don't appear to place any requirement on the home team to provide all the equipment needed to play a match, the first question to ask would be can that be taken for granted and does it include the provision of scoresheets? I'd say it could and it does, so the home team is at fault for not providing a scoresheet. The away player should have refused to start the game until he was provided with a scoresheet.

If the away team player didn't have a pen then that's his problem to sort out. If he was unable to borrow one, I'd let him leave the playing venue to go and buy one.

The home team captain's advice seems reasonable. If the away team player was then provided with scoresheet and pen then he should have used them. The league rules say mobile phones in the playing area must be switched off, so it's clearly against the rules to use one for scoring the game.

You don't say what, if anything, the away team captain did during this incident. The league rules say it's a joint responsibility of the team captains to resolve disputes. I'd tell the away team player that he could expect to be defaulted for breaking the mobile phone rules if he didn't turn it off.

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John Upham
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Re: Use of an electronic device whilst game in progress

Post by John Upham » Sun Aug 14, 2022 5:41 pm

Ian Thompson wrote:
Sun Aug 14, 2022 3:37 pm
You don't say what, if anything, the away team captain did during this incident. The league rules say it's a joint responsibility of the team captains to resolve disputes. I'd tell the away team player that he could expect to be defaulted for breaking the mobile phone rules if he didn't turn it off.
The away captain was on holiday in a remote location and had appointed the away player to be the away captain.
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Chris Goodall
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Re: Use of an electronic device whilst game in progress

Post by Chris Goodall » Sun Aug 14, 2022 7:15 pm

I would have plonked a pen and scoresheet on the table in front of the offending player and told him to turn the phone off. I can't believe a 4NCL player recording on their phone isn't at it. Notifications on silent, teammate who's finished their game running Stockfish.
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Joey Stewart
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Re: Use of an electronic device whilst game in progress

Post by Joey Stewart » Mon Aug 15, 2022 2:22 am

You don't HAVE to keep score at all (it just means you can't claim anything like repetitions or 50 move draws) so even if there genuinely was no access to a pen and scoresheet he could have just played on without (which is what I have done myself when in similar circumstances)- the fact he insisted on using the phone regardless of being told should have leaned a league official strongly towards a full point default for his opponent but without knowing the finer details of the case we can't be sure if there was perhaps something more to it...
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Chris Goodall
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Re: Use of an electronic device whilst game in progress

Post by Chris Goodall » Mon Aug 15, 2022 6:24 am

8.1 In the course of play each player is required to record his own moves and those of his opponent in the correct manner, move after move, as clearly and legibily as possible, in the algebraic notation (See Appendix C), on the scoresheet prescribed for the competition.

There is no penality prescribed for not recording, but it's clear cheating.
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Re: Use of an electronic device whilst game in progress

Post by Roger Lancaster » Mon Aug 15, 2022 6:59 am

Chris Goodall wrote:
Mon Aug 15, 2022 6:24 am
8.1 In the course of play each player is required to record his own moves and those of his opponent in the correct manner, move after move, as clearly and legibily as possible, in the algebraic notation (See Appendix C), on the scoresheet prescribed for the competition.

There is no penality prescribed for not recording, but it's clear cheating.
Except, of course, in rapidplay/blitz games and also in certain classical games, once a player's remaining time falls below 5 minutes.

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John Upham
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Re: Use of an electronic device whilst game in progress

Post by John Upham » Mon Aug 15, 2022 9:56 am

Joey Stewart wrote:
Mon Aug 15, 2022 2:22 am
You don't HAVE to keep score at all (it just means you can't claim anything like repetitions or 50 move draws) so even if there genuinely was no access to a pen and scoresheet he could have just played on without (which is what I have done myself when in similar circumstances)- the fact he insisted on using the phone regardless of being told should have leaned a league official strongly towards a full point default for his opponent but without knowing the finer details of the case we can't be sure if there was perhaps something more to it...
Just to re-iterate that scoresheets were freely available. They usually sit as pile on a large piece of furniture in the playing room.

The away player chose not to use a scoresheet but use a mobile telephone instead.
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MartinCarpenter
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Re: Use of an electronic device whilst game in progress

Post by MartinCarpenter » Mon Aug 15, 2022 10:16 am

John Upham wrote:
Mon Aug 15, 2022 9:56 am
Joey Stewart wrote:
Mon Aug 15, 2022 2:22 am
You don't HAVE to keep score at all (it just means you can't claim anything like repetitions or 50 move draws) so even if there genuinely was no access to a pen and scoresheet he could have just played on without (which is what I have done myself when in similar circumstances)- the fact he insisted on using the phone regardless of being told should have leaned a league official strongly towards a full point default for his opponent but without knowing the finer details of the case we can't be sure if there was perhaps something more to it...
Just to re-iterate that scoresheets were freely available. They usually sit as pile on the covered grand piano in the playing room.

The away player chose not to use a scoresheet but use a mobile telephone instead.
Well maybe, but how on earth did things reach move 10? Yes, we're all British - but still :) I'd have expected their teammates to have stepped in, never mind opponents.

Everyone has messed up quite badly. We can't tell if there's any preexisting bad blood around - far too common in chess to rule out :( - but its easy to be sympathetic with 0-0 whatever.

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IM Jack Rudd
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Re: Use of an electronic device whilst game in progress

Post by IM Jack Rudd » Mon Aug 15, 2022 12:07 pm

Chris Goodall wrote:
Mon Aug 15, 2022 6:24 am
8.1 In the course of play each player is required to record his own moves and those of his opponent in the correct manner, move after move, as clearly and legibily as possible, in the algebraic notation (See Appendix C), on the scoresheet prescribed for the competition.

There is no penality prescribed for not recording, but it's clear cheating.
Well, it's fouling. I wouldn't call it cheating unless the aim is to get an unfair advantage.