An English Opening system called the Mikenas-Flohr Variation

[AlanLlewellyn]

3..d6 blocks in the bishop though which makes it bit passive

[John Sellen]

Ok Alan lets put it another way
As you are very experienced in the English I accept you may well know the first 14 moves of theory in the Mikenas attack. The line in your game is decribed in great detail in The Iron English by Simon Williams.
What I find odd is that your opponent rated 1580 managed in a 45 min Online game to also come up with the best first 14 moves in what is a very sharp and complicated line. Is it possible he or she was using an engine or other form of outside assistance ?
Just a thought

[AlanLlewellyn]

Ok Alan lets put it another way
As you are very experienced in the English I accept you may well know the first 14 moves of theory in the Mikenas attack. The line in your game is decribed in great detail in The Iron English by Simon Williams.
What I find odd is that your opponent rated 1580 managed in a 45 min Online game to also come up with the best first 14 moves in what is a very sharp and complicated line. Is it possible he or she was using an engine or other form of outside assistance ?
Just a thought

i demonstrated the line to I think it was gm James Plaskett in the demonstration room, in British championships north shields 2012 and i know the line off by heart, though i did not know that 8.Ndb5 was best and had always played 8.Bf4 which isnt s good before but i have rarelly found anyone that knows the line-it is posible they researched my play and found i played 3 e4 in response to 1...Nf6 and 2...e6 in the english and then looked up the line, my games are on chessbase (about 70 games), i think that they may have had a book out at the time though. The moves after 8 Ndb5 were practically forced for white if he wanted to win the game i did offer a draw before he played the Ne7-c6 move but he refused.

[AlanLlewellyn]

i have even got my own opening book online displayed for all to see on my own personal website

[AlanLlewellyn]

[Event "World Championship 29th"] [Site "Baguio City"] [Date "1978.10.07"] [Round "29"] [White "Korchnoi, Viktor"] [Black "Karpov, Anatoly"] [Result "1-0"] [ECO "A19"] [WhiteElo "2665"] [BlackElo "2725"] [PlyCount "157"] [EventDate "1978.??.??"] 1. c4 Nf6 2. Nc3 e6 3. e4 c5 4. e5 Ng8 5. d4 cxd4 6. Qxd4 Nc6 7. Qe4 d6 8. Nf3 dxe5 9. Nxe5 Nf6 10. Nxc6 Qb6 11. Qf3 bxc6 12. Be2 Bb7 13. O-O c5 14. Qh3 Be7 15. Bf3 O-O 16. b3 Rfd8 17. Be3 Bc6 18. Na4 Qc7 19. Bxc6 Qxc6 20. Rad1 Rac8 21. Qg3 Bd6 22. Qh4 Be7 23. f3 Kf8 24. Qf2 Rxd1 25. Rxd1 Qc7 26. Qg3 Qxg3 27. hxg3 h5 28. Kf2 Ke8 29. Ke2 g6 30. Nc3 a6 31. Na4 Rc6 32. Rh1 Bd6 33. Bf2 Nd7 34. g4 hxg4 35. Rh8+ Ke7 36. fxg4 g5 37. Be3 f6 38. Nc3 Kf7 39. Rh7+ Ke8 40. Ne4 Be7 41. Rh6 Kf7 42. Rh7+ Kf8 43. Rh8+ Kf7 44. Bd2 Nf8 45. Rh1 Kg6 46. Rd1 f5 47. Nf2 Bd6 48. Bc3 Nd7 49. gxf5+ exf5 50. g4 Nb6 51. Kf3 Be7 52. Ba5 Rf6 53. Kg2 fxg4 54. Nxg4 Re6 55. Kf3 Bf6 56. Nxf6 Rxf6+ 57. Kg4 Nc8 58. Bd8 Rf4+ 59. Kg3 Rf5 60. a4 Kf7 61. Rd3 Re5 62. Kg4 Kg6 63. a5 Re4+ 64. Kf3 Rf4+ 65. Ke3 Rh4 66. Rd5 Rh3+ 67. Kd2 Rxb3 68. Rxc5 Rb8 69. Rc6+ Kf5 70. Rxa6 g4 71. Rf6+ Ke4 72. Bc7 Rb2+ 73. Kc3 Rb7 74. Bh2 Rh7 75. Bb8 Rb7 76. Bg3 Rb1 77. Rf4+ Ke3 78. Rf8 Ne7 79. a6 1-0
there is a divergence from the game mentioned is that the one you were talking about 29th of the 1978 match in bagio

[IM Jack Rudd]

Ok Alan lets put it another way
As you are very experienced in the English I accept you may well know the first 14 moves of theory in the Mikenas attack. The line in your game is decribed in great detail in The Iron English by Simon Williams.
What I find odd is that your opponent rated 1580 managed in a 45 min Online game to also come up with the best first 14 moves in what is a very sharp and complicated line. Is it possible he or she was using an engine or other form of outside assistance ?
Just a thought

Well, it's not as if most of those moves are exactly difficult to come up with for black. 8...f6 is the only one that looks unusual.

[AlanLlewellyn]

Well, it's not as if most of those moves are exactly difficult to come up with for black. 8...f6 is the only one that looks unusual.

8...f6 is played to make a6 greater threat as if a6 is played Bf4 causes trouble

[AlanLlewellyn]

[Event "Foxwoods op"] [Site "Ledyard"] [Date "2009.04.10"] [Round "5"] [White "Nakamura, Hikaru"] [Black "Hess, Robert L"] [Result "0-1"] [ECO "A19"] [WhiteElo "2701"] [BlackElo "2485"] [PlyCount "98"] [EventDate "2009.04.08"] [EventType "swiss"] [EventRounds "9"] [EventCountry "USA"] [SourceTitle "CBM 129 Extra"] [Source "ChessBase"] [SourceDate "2009.05.05"] [SourceVersion "2"] [SourceVersionDate "2009.05.20"] [SourceQuality "1"] 1. c4 Nf6 2. Nc3 e6 3. e4 c5 4. e5 Ng8 5. Nf3 Nc6 6. d4 cxd4 7. Nxd4 Nxe5 8. Ndb5 f6 9. Bf4 a6 10. Nd6+ Bxd6 11. Qxd6 Nf7 12. Qa3 Ne7 13. Nb5 e5 14. Bd2 d6 15. Bb4 Nf5 16. O-O-O Be6 17. Nxd6+ N7xd6 18. Bxd6 Nxd6 19. Rxd6 Qe7 20. Be2 Rc8 21. b3 Kf7 22. Kb2 Rhd8 23. Rhd1 Rxd6 24. Rxd6 Rd8 25. c5 a5 26. Bh5+ g6 27. Bf3 Qc7 28. Rxd8 Qxd8 29. Kc1 Bf5 30. b4 Qd4 31. bxa5 Qxf2 32. Qb3+ Kg7 33. Qxb7+ Kh6 34. Qb2 Qxc5+ 35. Kd1 e4 36. Be2 e3 37. Ke1 Qxa5+ 38. Kf1 Qc7 39. Qd4 Qc1+ 40. Qd1 Qb2 41. a4 Qb4 42. Kg1 Bd7 43. Qa1 Qf4 44. Qf1 Qxf1+ 45. Kxf1 Bxa4 46. Bd3 Bd1 47. Be2 Bc2 48. Bb5 f5 49. g3 g5 0-1 hess beats nakamura playing 13...e5 in that opening

[AlanLlewellyn]

actually 9 Be3 is the actual main line as played by Miles vs Karpov 9 Bf4 is a waste of time if Black spots 13...e5, 13...d6 is terrible for black, loses the gambit pawn and white develops a strong attack the idea is to get Bb6 in to trap the Queen, i could be missing a whole load of theory here it is such an out of fashion ex popular line.

[AlanLlewellyn]

Nick and john and indeed jack, these sophisticated opening play pops up a lot against me i am used to it now, even complete begginers to the game play 20 moves of theory often against me. and i am talking about otb too.

[AlanLlewellyn]

what i am thinking is its something to do with my politics and my chess ability being unpopular with a certain russian intelligence bureau

[Roger de Coverly]

i could be missing a whole load of theory here it is such an out of fashion ex popular line.

With the ability over the last twenty five years or more to review the pet lines of opponents, it could be that players who might like to play the Nimzo or QID will play 1. .. e6 2. Nc3 Bb4 rather than 1. c4 Nf6 2. Nc3 e6.

The sequence 1. c4 Nf6 2. Nc3 g6 3. e4 is used by players to avoid the Grunfeld. KID players aren't bothered by that move order. There is still an attempt to force the Grunfeld by 1. c4 Nf6 2. Nc3 d5 which could also lead to QGD positions.

[AlanLlewellyn]

Matt Mackenzie(a forum stalwart) plays 1 c4 e5 2 Nc3 Bb4 then i play 3 Nf3 Nc6 4 g3 Nf6 5 Nd5 to get in a well known theoretical debate

[AlanLlewellyn]

as black me as white the system being similar to the one with e6 and Bb4

[John Sellen]

Alan
"what i am thinking is its something to do with my politics and my chess ability being unpopular with a certain russian intelligence bureau"

Please please try and concentrate on this thread
You have initiated a really worthwhile discussion about some interesting lines in the English
Well done
This has nothing to do with "russian intelligence"
PLease keep up yor interesting chess posts