Aditya Verma

[Paul Habershon]

It’s frightening how quickly social media can come back to bite you on the arse these days. Potentially a £100,000 plus elite private education spaffed up the wall with a ten word snapchat to friends. A cautionary tale unfolding.

Note that Aditya attended St Olaves, a state school.

Yes, St Olave's and chess. I remember the Labour politician Harriet Harman getting flak for sending one of her sons to that selective grammar school. When visiting prospective schools the clincher, apparently, for the boy at St Olave's was seeing a room full of pupils playing chess.

[Matt Bridgeman]

I don't doubt that they have the power to convict, but I would hope and think that a young man with a promising future ahead of him, no previous convictions who sent a joke in bad taste to what he believed was a private channel with zero intent to provoke alarm would be treated accordingly.
I am quite sure he has already learnt a very painful lesson.

It seems a reach at the moment as the Spanish did scrabble two fighter jets and in their first court hearing have seemingly bumped the case up to their High Court because they see the case as one of national security. No further action seems unlikely at the moment.

[Jonathan Bryant]

... a young man with a promising future ahead of him, no previous convictions who sent a joke in bad taste to what he believed was a private channel with zero intent to provoke alarm would be treated accordingly.
I am quite sure he has already learnt a very painful lesson.

I don’t necessarily disagree with that per se - but repeating something irrelevant isn’t going to make it sudddnly relevant. Also how is that different to the property developer/Grenfell chap? Is the suggestion that age is the key difference here? Or something else.

Also how are you - legally - proposing to distinguish between ‘it was a joke’ here and when it’s put forward by somebody else who really would have done harm had they not been stopped from doing so.

It’s not that I don’t have any sympathy with the promising future/acted like a pillock but not fundamentally malicious
argument, quite the reverse.

The fact is, though, that large numbers of boys and young men are criminalised and have problematic futures for what are essentially acts of DickHeadary.

If we’re going to allow a defence of “has already learned a lesson” as a defence here then we really need to explain
why it doesn’t apply at other times.

[Matt Bridgeman]

One the jets was of the same type to the recent Top Gun movie apparently - news reaching the Australian news outlets;

https://www.news.com.au/travel/travel-u ... a16e086ab0

All sounds extremely painful stuff with talk of Eastjet passing huge civil costs down to the parents, breaches of Air Navigation laws and lifetime air travel bans. If any of that stuff happens it sounds like bad news!

[Ian Thompson]

All sounds extremely painful stuff with talk of Eastjet passing huge civil costs down to the parents

How could the parents be held liable for the actions of an adult son? Unless he's an unusually wealthy teenager, wouldn't the end result of huge civil costs be bankruptcy?

[Matt Bridgeman]

All sounds extremely painful stuff with talk of Eastjet passing huge civil costs down to the parents

How could the parents be held liable for the actions of an adult son? Unless he's an unusually wealthy teenager, wouldn't the end result of huge civil costs be bankruptcy?

No idea how the Spanish courts would play it, but any UK court would offer a repayment scheme. Kind of figure the parents will probably wear it though. Does sound a little like they may be hit with the double whammy of both a criminal and a civil claim. But who knows, maybe the criminal side will drop off with a bit of legal wrangling.

[Joey Stewart]

Given that easyJet have been robbing millions of pounds from customers through missed fights the last few years I think it would be a PR nightmare for them to turn around and be seen making a big public case trying to bully tens of thousands out of an innocent chess player.
Best case scenario will likely be to arrange some sort of long term deal with the Spanish authorities and then 'forget' to pay it all, it's not like they have any legal jurisdiction here anymore once he gets back to the UK - score one point for Brexit there!

[JustinHorton]

You may find that extradition agreements between Spain and the UK were not dependent on EU membership and did not expire when it came to an end. (Also, I do not think the legal action has been instigated by EasyJet.)

[Mick Norris]

I don't doubt that they have the power to convict, but I would hope and think that a young man with a promising future ahead of him, no previous convictions who sent a joke in bad taste to what he believed was a private channel with zero intent to provoke alarm would be treated accordingly.
I am quite sure he has already learnt a very painful lesson.

Young man with a promising future?

Ah yes, as opposed to Northern lad from a deprived area who can't afford to go to University, who presumably wouldn't be let off

[Andrew Zigmond]

Sounds like they will have their fingers crossed the National High Court bats the case back to the UK. Does anyone know how long the court process is likely to take in Spain?

It’s pretty much in all the online papers now; https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/53ed ... 937a799b17

It does seem a bit of a nonsense that a little bit of discussion on an obscure forum is going to prejudice a fair trial when the story is already in every news outlet in the country more or less.

I don't dare read the online comments in these publications for the sake of my blood pressure but I suspect there is a lot of abuse in there bordering on racism (which incidentally is the reason many older chess players are taking sick glee in it). However if it was sub judice in the UK they would have to close off comments due to the risk of violating contempt of court laws - that risk still stands even in a relatively unread forum such as this one.

Andrew, you seem to be suggesting that many older chess players are racist, or am I misreading this? I'd like a clarification on that point please

Thanks
Mick

I was away overnight yesterday so I have only just been able to return to this and answer Mick's question.

Yes, I am suggesting that many older chess players are racist. I am not suggesting that every older chess player is racist (many are passionate anti racists) or that anybody who has contributed to this thread is racist.

But it does concern me how this is being "bigged up" within the chess community. The actual incident has no connection to chess, except that the person in question happens to play it to a very reasonable standard. A fair few chess players have done far worse things (that we know about). Conversely many young people from even more affluent backgrounds have done far worse things abroad - not always with consequence.

[JustinHorton]

But it does concern me how this is being "bigged up" within the chess community.

Before you got in a strop about it it had been, I think, the subject of a whole three postings, of which precisely one made any comment on the events.

[Matt Bridgeman]

I’m not really seeing the racism angle. There may be a flavour of people being a bit tired of entitled elitist idiocy, probably because of the constant Westminster nonsense.

[Nick Burrows]

Also how is that different to the property developer/Grenfell chap? Is the suggestion that age is the key difference here? Or something else.

Also how are you - legally - proposing to distinguish between ‘it was a joke’ here and when it’s put forward by somebody else who really would have done harm had they not been stopped from doing so.

The difference between the Grenfell case is that there, the making of the model was done in advance and 'pre-meditated', then taken and acted out in a more public setting and was accompanied by racist comments.

I would suggest that if this communication had been fished out of a private group chat from normal life and away from an airport, the majority of people would think - 'big deal'.

If indeed, it was as I described - a joke intended solely for friends with entirely unintended consequences - then a criminal conviction is disproportionate. Proving it legally may be a different matter, but I'd like to think that the legal process will arrive at the truth of it.

[Nick Burrows]

Young man with a promising future?

Ah yes, as opposed to Northern lad from a deprived area who can't afford to go to University, who presumably wouldn't be let off

As a Northern lad from a deprived area who didn't go to university, I would say that the same punishment can have a disproprtionate penalty.

[John Upham]

Yes, I am suggesting that many older chess players are racist.

Could you extend this deeply researched and peer reviewed thesis to

Yes, I am suggesting that many older <any sport> players are racist.

or even

Yes, I am suggesting that many older people are racist.

or what about

Yes, I am suggesting that many people are racist.

We look forward to your evidence being submitted.