New Estonian PM

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Paul McKeown
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Re: New Estonian PM

Post by Paul McKeown » Mon Feb 01, 2021 11:48 pm

MJMcCready wrote:
Mon Feb 01, 2021 11:14 pm
Jonathan Rogers wrote:
Mon Feb 01, 2021 9:04 pm
Didn't Estonia obtain independence in 1991? Your question seems bizarre.
But whether she sees herself as a child of the Soviet Union, or more proudly as Estonian, is another matter. For political purposes she has to state she is Estonian but on a personal level perhaps she is more nostalgic, sentimental and sees herself as still Soviet.
You clearly have never been to Estonia, nor spoken with an Estonian. The population of Estonian ethnic origin have only loathing for the Soviet Union, having suffered occupation and lost territory, endured political repression, exile and death. Even three decades after the Singing Revolution, they must maintain dignity in the face of frequent provocations on the border. Meanwhile, the Russian speaking minority (from all parts of the former USSR) have no desire to live in Russia, or any other part of its former empire, either. Their preference is for Western democratic norms, EU membership including free movement and a thriving market economy. There are a few older Russian speakers who long for the certitudes of the USSR, but their children and grand-children certainly do not.

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MJMcCready
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Re: New Estonian PM

Post by MJMcCready » Tue Feb 02, 2021 1:05 am

You need to learn how to read. It's clearly stated that I visited it in 96, and your major points have been referred to. Please read the posts before commenting.

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Re: New Estonian PM

Post by Paul McKeown » Tue Feb 02, 2021 1:12 am

And you have clearly never actually spoken to an Estonian on the matter, because if you had you wouldn't have written such rubbish. Point out this magical population of Estonian lovers of the Soviet Union - and not the one that is only between your ears.

And before you go on arguing about it, just let me say that I was married to an Estonian of Russian ethnic origin, have spent a very long time in the country, seen the country from top to bottom, and have mixed with very many Estonians of Estonian and Russian heritage. Not only that but I still keep contact with many Estonians.

If you wish to argue until you're blue in the face, go right ahead. I've said all I will say on the matter.

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Re: New Estonian PM

Post by Paul McKeown » Tue Feb 02, 2021 1:51 am

To understand Estonian feelings towards the Soviet Union, you have to understand not only the history in the immediate aftermath of the occupation of the first republic, but also the society in the 1970s and 1980s. Unlike almost all other parts of the USSR, they could actually receive radio and television broadcasts from across the Baltic - even if it was legally forbidden. They were acquainted with life in Finland and Sweden at the time, not only the memories of their grandparents telling of their neighbours who ran away to Sweden in 1944, and a whispered history of Haapsalu and the western islands. It wasn't only the ethnic Estonians who listened in, either, but ethnic Russians, too. And they all wanted part of that life. Very different situation from the middle of Asia, where the nearest foreign state was Mongolia or Iran or China.

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Re: New Estonian PM

Post by Paul McKeown » Tue Feb 02, 2021 2:38 am

And finally there is the question of economy.

https://www.macrotrends.net/countries/E ... per-capita

From $3,000 GDP per capita in 1993 to $23,660 in 2018.

That's a very beautiful curve.

http://visualdata.cepii.fr/CountryProfi ... ry=Estonia

(second tab, "Projections", Table 1 - Population and GDP)

And the forecast for 2025 to be on a par with the UK in terms of GDP per capita, and if trends continue to completely outstrip it by 2050. (I know, I know. Union Jack socked bulldog owners, the pith-helmeted, and the Brexis will be foaming at such thought crime.)

With that economy no Estonian would dream of going back to the past.

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Re: New Estonian PM

Post by Paul McKeown » Wed Feb 03, 2021 3:48 pm

Xie Jun was also made an MP, in 1993. Admittedly in China's Parliament of Rubber Stamps.

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