Closing Gambit

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JustinHorton
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Re: Closing Gambit

Post by JustinHorton » Tue Jan 05, 2021 3:24 pm

Geoff Chandler wrote:
Tue Jan 05, 2021 2:48 pm
Hi Dave,

"I don't recall it being suggested that that included all his chess books."

The wiki site says:

"...having smuggled his chess library out of the USSR in two stages, on this trip as well as the previous year's trip to England."

I know Wiki is not always reliable but that is what it says
Well the source is given as Ray's apparently authoritative book so I guess you can check it out there
"Do you play chess?"
"Yes, but I prefer a game with a better chance of cheating."

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Geoff Chandler
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Re: Closing Gambit

Post by Geoff Chandler » Tue Jan 05, 2021 4:35 pm

Hi Justin,

Ray mentions it in 'Chess Crises'.
He does not say chess books, just says various personal momentos including the photo album.
Either Ray sourced himself from somewhere else or who ever knocked up the wiki page got it wrong.

The source for the bit in question just says 'Keene'
Two sources down (no.39) is the only Mention of 'Chess Crisis' so it would appear they never got it from the book.

(BTW 'dissection'. You will love the way Ray dissects game 13 in 'Chess Crisis.')

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JustinHorton
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Re: Closing Gambit

Post by JustinHorton » Tue Jan 05, 2021 5:04 pm

Geoff Chandler wrote:
Tue Jan 05, 2021 4:35 pm

The source for the bit in question just says 'Keene'
Two sources down (no.39) is the only Mention of 'Chess Crisis' so it would appear they never got it from the book.
The reference is to his book on the 1978 match
"Do you play chess?"
"Yes, but I prefer a game with a better chance of cheating."

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Geoff Chandler
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Re: Closing Gambit

Post by Geoff Chandler » Tue Jan 05, 2021 6:23 pm

Hi Justin.

Not quite correct.

Cite No.37 just says 'Keene.' nothing else.

When they use something from the Karpov match book it says so giving further details.

33. Karpov–Korchnoi 1978: the Inside Story of the Match, by Raymond Keene, London, Batsford 1978, pp. 17–19

If they are linking it citation 37 via the links given to citation 33 then pages 17-19 say nothing books or photo albums.
other pages mentioned from the Karpov match book also say nothing about books etc... Wiki has it wrong.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Viktor_Korchnoi

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JustinHorton
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Re: Closing Gambit

Post by JustinHorton » Tue Jan 05, 2021 6:44 pm

Geoff Chandler wrote:
Tue Jan 05, 2021 6:23 pm
Hi Justin.

Not quite correct.

Cite No.37 just says 'Keene.' nothing else.
That means they're referring to notes above. (An academic work would likely say "op cit".) It doesn't mean "Keene said this somewhere but we don't know where or aren't saying". Plainly they should also give the title since this is what has been done at notes 21 and 24 and the point of indexing (a qualified librarian writes) is that it's supposed to be consistent, and come to that I wouldn't say no to some page numbers, but its meaning surely is "the Keene work already cited".
"Do you play chess?"
"Yes, but I prefer a game with a better chance of cheating."

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Re: Closing Gambit

Post by Geoff Chandler » Tue Jan 05, 2021 7:29 pm

Hi Justin,

" but its meaning surely is "the Keene work already cited".

or surely it is not. :)

I'm locked in, I can do this all day but Mrs 'C' wants to throw money away on the Tombola
so I'm off to sulk in my chess study where I, on purpose, have no internet, or telly, just a DAB radio.
chess sets and books...100's of chess books...I'll play over some Tarrasch.

Think I'll re-work my Bob Wade gag, pics of hotel, dates, smuggles caves , false docs, gunfights with the KGB and blog it.
The danger is somebody will believe me - it took me 30 years to wriggle my way out of my one and only one, I'm Murray Chandlers
Dad joke and even now people are telling me I am.

I'll give you 1-0
if asked before this I would said the 'books in England ' piece was also in the Karpov book.
(it maybe tucked in a game note - sure it's there but not the pages mentioned) Take Care.

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Re: Closing Gambit

Post by Jonathan Bryant » Wed Jan 06, 2021 3:50 am

Geoff Chandler wrote:
Mon Jan 04, 2021 9:43 pm
Spassky was allowed to marry his French fiancée ....
Eventually. The story made the front page of the Times which can been seen here -

https://streathambrixtonchess.blogspot. ... s-xiv.html




Incidentally, that same front page covers Martina Navritilova’s defection. Older forumites will no doubt recall that she was assassinated each and every year she won Wimbledon thereafter.

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Re: Closing Gambit

Post by Tim Spanton » Wed Jan 06, 2021 9:58 am

Jonathan Bryant wrote:
Wed Jan 06, 2021 3:50 am
Geoff Chandler wrote:
Mon Jan 04, 2021 9:43 pm
Spassky was allowed to marry his French fiancée ....
Eventually. The story made the front page of the Times which can been seen here -

https://streathambrixtonchess.blogspot. ... s-xiv.html




Incidentally, that same front page covers Martina Navritilova’s defection. Older forumites will no doubt recall that she was assassinated each and every year she won Wimbledon thereafter.
There were assassination attempts each and every year, but I believe I am correct in stating none quite succeeded

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JustinHorton
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Re: Closing Gambit

Post by JustinHorton » Wed Jan 06, 2021 10:30 am

This is a metaphor, yes?
"Do you play chess?"
"Yes, but I prefer a game with a better chance of cheating."

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John McKenna
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Re: Closing Gambit

Post by John McKenna » Wed Jan 06, 2021 11:32 am

No it's not.

It is ridicule.

Ridiculing a post that used ridicule.

Fighting fire with fire.
To find a for(u)m that accommodates the mess, that is the task of the artist now. (Samuel Beckett)

Tim Spanton
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Re: Closing Gambit

Post by Tim Spanton » Wed Jan 06, 2021 11:54 am

John McKenna wrote:
Wed Jan 06, 2021 11:32 am
No it's not.

It is ridicule.

Ridiculing a post that used ridicule.

Fighting fire with fire.
My uncle was a strong believer in fighting fire with fire. But he became embittered that his principles cost him his job with the London Fire Brigade.

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Re: Closing Gambit

Post by John Sellen » Wed Jan 06, 2021 12:08 pm

I love this forum
When i innocently opened this thread a few days ago just to point out that Closing Gambit is showing tomorrow , never did i imagine it would generate so much passion both for and against the documentary !!
I look forward to seeing it myself ( I did look at the trailer on Amazon and it looked very interesting )

Kevin Thurlow
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Re: Closing Gambit

Post by Kevin Thurlow » Wed Jan 06, 2021 12:35 pm

"When i innocently opened this thread a few days ago just to point out that Closing Gambit is showing tomorrow , never did i imagine it would generate so much passion both for and against the documentary !!
I look forward to seeing it myself ( I did look at the trailer on Amazon and it looked very interesting )"

You'll get used to that. You will also see if you agree with any of the reviews, good and bad.

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Re: Closing Gambit

Post by John Upham » Wed Jan 06, 2021 5:13 pm

Here is one of my favourite videos of fighting fire with fire.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WaRcH8K7yY8
British Chess News : britishchessnews.com
Twitter: @BritishChess
Facebook: facebook.com/groups/britishchess :D

Mike Gunn
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Re: Closing Gambit

Post by Mike Gunn » Wed Jan 06, 2021 5:40 pm

I have seen this film and it made very little impression on me because (for those of us who lived through it and followed the match at the time) it contained very little that is new. It was marginally interesting to the comments of some of those involved (e.g. Michael Stean) but there are no chess games and the politics of the match has been very thoroughly covered elsewhere.

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